480 question

[wittyair]

I just landed an absolute mint 480 in Fireglo ( except for a bit of fretboard checking ) and noticed it
has Grover tuners. There is no evidence that the tuners have been changed but are those original???

[deaconblues]

Depends on the year. At one point Grovers were factory issue. The 'gumby' headstock was actually introduced to give them more room.

Check out this page of the '75 catalog: http://www.rickenbacker.com/catalog_pos ... cf75-7.jpg

[wittyair]

It's an 82.....and as I said, I see no evidence of a change, I just wasn't aware RIC used Grovers.
I'll try to get a picture up tomorrow......it really is in quite remarkable shape. Scotty......get out your magnifying glass!!

[Scastles]

Here was a question/answer regarding Grovers with J. Hall. It can be found on this site.

Date: 1998/08/29

Question: I have a 1987 320 JG with Grover tuners. My 1987 620 FG has Schallers. My 1997 360 also has the "Made in Germany" stamp on the tuners. When did Ric switch tuners?

Answer: Unfortunately, there's no precise date for the switch as stocks of different brands and types of keys have existed until differerent points in time. But more generally speaking, we had some quality issues with Grover and subsequently found out that major parts of these keys were being produced in Taiwan or Korea (I forget which . . .). I told Rich Berger, their CEO, that I would never order an Asian key again, as a result. In actuality, I wasn't able to keep that promise entirely, as the best reproduction "Kluson Deluxe" keys were coming from Gotoh in Japan and we really had no choice but to use them. But as soon as I convinced Helmut Schaller to make some changes in his version of that key for the sake of authenticity, we immediately switched our business to Schaller in Germany.

http://www.rickresource.com/rrp/JHaccessories.html

[badeggs]

480s are just killer! And I love when those who don't know trot out their "but it's a bolt-on neck it must be awful!" **** - they have no idea what they're missing...

[IHeartRics]

480s are just killer! And I love when those who don't know trot out their "but it's a bolt-on neck it must be awful!" **** - they have no idea what they're missing...

Actually, I think the bolt on neck may be a positive for the guitar. I may be way off on this, but to me, the 480 gets a little bit of a thinner sound and a little less sustain than a neck-through-the-body, so it retains a lttle more jangle or acoustic vibe.

[doctorwho]

480s are just killer! And I love when those who don't know trot out their "but it's a bolt-on neck it must be awful!" **** - they have no idea what they're missing...

+1

It does take some adjusting to the flat profile, but once one does, look out!

[badeggs]

Actually, I think the bolt on neck may be a positive for the guitar. I may be way off on this, but to me, the 480 gets a little bit of a thinner sound and a little less sustain than a neck-through-the-body, so it retains a little more jangle or acoustic vibe.

It's thin, true, but to me it's always had an "angry Telecaster" vibe to it - not so much jangle, really.

And it's more than that: the flat fingerboard, the angled-back neck - it's just a quirky little guitar!

[wittyair]

Stan-thanks for that link. I was convinced these tuners had not been changed. I'll get some pics up
of this 480 tomorrow......it truly is in absolutely unbelievable condition.....blew me away when I opened it up.

[jingle_jangle]

480s are just killer! And I love when those who don't know trot out their "but it's a bolt-on neck it must be awful!" **** - they have no idea what they're missing...

Once again, I should re-state that scientific tests have shown that bolt-on necks deliver more sustain than neck-through construction.

Regarding the "Gumby" headstock being introduced to give the Grovers more room...if that's true, then it sure failed on my Ruby 360/6 WB! There is less than 1/16" clearance between the tuning keys of those Grovers and the edge of the headstock, and over the years this has led to fingernail chipping of the Ruby paint on the headstock.

[deaconblues]

Guess I read this quote wrong:

The only reason the head was made larger was to give the larger Schaller M6 key buttons some extra space to turn. It never had anything to do with tone or strength.

BUT:

Did they use M6s in 1975? I think the Grovers were used first, and the gumby head came at roughly the same time as they did. Also, while Grovers have a rather large button, Schallers use a smaller one very similar in size to Klusons.

The idea, I think, was not to make the buttons stick out more, but to make more room between each one. Picture a 'classic' headstock with Grovers...

[4003]

My grungy 1976 480 has Kluson Deluxe tuners. I really should play it more often. I love the flat fingerboard and it has a good rock sound.

[jingle_jangle]

Guess I read this quote wrong:

The only reason the head was made larger was to give the larger Schaller M6 key buttons some extra space to turn. It never had anything to do with tone or strength.

BUT:

Did they use M6s in 1975? I think the Grovers were used first, and the gumby head came at roughly the same time as they did. Also, while Grovers have a rather large button, Schallers use a smaller one very similar in size to Klusons.

The idea, I think, was not to make the buttons stick out more, but to make more room between each one. Picture a 'classic' headstock with Grovers...

Well, they should have done both. Lots of in-between room. No headstock clearance...





Doesn't it look really odd with the tuner shafts tucked all that way into the headstock? Seems like the headstock on this one got wider--it's the widest boat-paddle I've ever seen--but the tuner shaft holes stayed in the same locations as the "old" narrower headstock. Note that the TRC is actually notched (not too neatly, either), to clear the washer around the low "E" shaft. This would negate the claim of enlarging them to provide more space between...

[scotty]

Cant wait Craig!

[1965]

I just wasn't aware RIC used Grovers.

From the factory on a '66