How to adjust modern 4003 neck?
Moderators: rickenbrother, ajish4
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rickless
How to adjust modern 4003 neck?
I've never adjusted the neck of a Rick bass before, but I want to adjust mine. I've adjusted the necks of my other basses before, but they only had one truss rod. Don't I need a special tool to adjust it? How do I keep from creating an S-curve or causing any other harm?
You need a thin-wall 1/4 inch socket. The best bet is to get a factory wrench either from a Rickenbacker dealer or directly from Rickenbacker. They cost about $16 these days. They just plain fit and most importantly will not munge your nuts (I hate when that happens!). Ricks made in 86 and later have a compression type rod system similar to Fender and others. Before 86 rods of and expansion type were used. These older rods require some care to adjust. The neck must be moved into place by hand first and then the nuts can be snugged to hold it there. THESE RODS ARE NOT MEANT TO MOVE THE NECK, ONLY TO HOLD IT IN PLACE. I can't sress that enough. The newer rods can be freely adjusted in either direction without much concern. With both types, you tighten the rods to counter the pull of the strings. In exreme cases of relief correction, John Hall suggests using the manual method even for the newer rod system. I do it this way. While seated in a chair, I place the instument between my knees and hold the bottom end between my feet. Then I move the neck into position against my thigh by grabbing the neck near the nut and pulling it backwards. I then snug the rod adjustment, retune and check for relief. There are probably a hundred different ways of doing this. This has been my method for several years with great success. Don't turn the nuts more than 1/4 turn at a time. If you go more than a full turn all together, let the instrument sit for a while (as long as 2 days) to make sure the neck is not over corrected. Remember to go slowly.
Try this method guys - straight from the Rickenbacker web site. This is what I use successfully. Although in extreme cases I have use the method that Ted described above.
http://www.rickenbacker.com/us/neck.htm
http://www.rickenbacker.com/us/neck.htm
I always relieve the tension from the strings on the neck on old or new Rics it's just a prudent thing to do. I have my own method but is very similar to Ted's, I put the bottom of the bass on a rug with my foot in front so it won't move, them put my knee behind the top of the body and pull back near the nut area, then adjust, I do more than snug them up, I make them fairly tight but do not force them. I then let go and check the action, I may have to repeat this several times and in extreme cases this may take some days or even weeks if the neck was extremely bowed for a long time. The main thing is don't force the nuts and use a nut driver as Ted has suggested, you can much better judge the amount of pressure you are putting on the nuts.
The modern rods are round steel shafts anchored at both ends. Tightening the nuts shortens the rods so, in effect, they attempt to pull one end closer to the other - compress. Because they lie in a slightly curved channel there is a fulcrum that allows them to work against the pull of the strings. The older rods are 4 foot pieces of mild steel flat wire folded nearly in half. One side is slightly longer than the other. Tightening the nut draws the rod trough the aluminum block until the shorter side stops against the bottom of the block. At this point the halves of the rod tend to bow and spring apart (expand) . In use they maintain a constant length but expand front to back when tightend. Maybe my terminology is bad as far as expansion goes. Perhaps the old rods are better described as variable springs. Tightening the nuts increases the spring constant. The newer rods are very similar to the rods used by Fender and Gibson.
Ted is correct in his description of the rod although I'll point out that neither Fender nor Gibson rods can be simply changed in the field like ours, without having to do wood or finish work.
Also, I'm afraid I mildly disagree with Robert's advice about relieving the string tension, at least on older instruments (i.e. detuning). That is, of course what you're doing already by pushing the neck into position yourself before tightening the rod. The problem with detuning is that when you release the manual pressure after turning the nuts, the rods are now not pushing back against normal tension so they're going to slip. I guess it's all a matter of degree but if you're careful not to push the neck too far, you'll get the job done easier if you keep it tuned.
Also, I'm afraid I mildly disagree with Robert's advice about relieving the string tension, at least on older instruments (i.e. detuning). That is, of course what you're doing already by pushing the neck into position yourself before tightening the rod. The problem with detuning is that when you release the manual pressure after turning the nuts, the rods are now not pushing back against normal tension so they're going to slip. I guess it's all a matter of degree but if you're careful not to push the neck too far, you'll get the job done easier if you keep it tuned.
John, thanks for setting me straight. I hadn't seen the new style rods outside of an instrument but somehow I had the impression they were like the Warmoth rods, welded two-piece with the top piece flat. But I went back and looked at the "Truss Rod Replacements" thread from a couple of months ago up in the Vibrola section and sure enough, there are Jeff Rath's pics of the rods and they are single. Guess I should have kept reading that thread all the way through.
So there's obviously a difference between the way these and the Gibson design are anchored, with the Ric design the anchor is external. Is the channel curve symmetrical, or is it more curved near the headstock and then straightens out? Just curious.
When you think about it, all truss rod designs compress the wood in some way.
So there's obviously a difference between the way these and the Gibson design are anchored, with the Ric design the anchor is external. Is the channel curve symmetrical, or is it more curved near the headstock and then straightens out? Just curious.
When you think about it, all truss rod designs compress the wood in some way.
OK while we're on the subject, here's a problem I encountered today with a modern Ric bass neck (not mine).
It's a new bass. The neck has two "S" curves, or rather an "M" curve - two very slight upward bows peaking at around the 4th and 14th frets, and a concave bow in the middle. These are very slight bows, but they are visible if you know how to look.
Whatever I tried to do with the truss rods, I couldn't fix it.
THEN there's the bridge, which is all the way down, and still the action is rather high for my taste. It's what you can call "medium" action, even medium-high. The only way to lower the action could be using the truss rods, but any attempt caused pronounced fret buzz or choking of the vibrating string, making it impossible to play in the 2nd-5th frets area.
Remember, this is Israel and currently there is no authorized RIC dealer here.
The owner suggested trying to deepen the grooves in the bridge saddles.
Has anyone encoutered anything like this before? What would you do? He really doesn't want to consider anything major like defretting, stripping the fretboard, planing it, refinishing and refretting.
Will a fret redress do the trick?
It's a new bass. The neck has two "S" curves, or rather an "M" curve - two very slight upward bows peaking at around the 4th and 14th frets, and a concave bow in the middle. These are very slight bows, but they are visible if you know how to look.
Whatever I tried to do with the truss rods, I couldn't fix it.
THEN there's the bridge, which is all the way down, and still the action is rather high for my taste. It's what you can call "medium" action, even medium-high. The only way to lower the action could be using the truss rods, but any attempt caused pronounced fret buzz or choking of the vibrating string, making it impossible to play in the 2nd-5th frets area.
Remember, this is Israel and currently there is no authorized RIC dealer here.
The owner suggested trying to deepen the grooves in the bridge saddles.
Has anyone encoutered anything like this before? What would you do? He really doesn't want to consider anything major like defretting, stripping the fretboard, planing it, refinishing and refretting.
Will a fret redress do the trick?
"A Noble Instrument Must Be Nobly Regarded"
Also, I'm afraid I mildly disagree with Robert's advice about relieving the string tension, at least on older instruments (i.e. detuning).
John, I never detune my basses, I should have been more specific, I agree with you 100%. I leave it tuned and just back bow the neck a little to relieve the pressure from the strings on the TR's. After I tighten the nuts I release the pressure and check to see how the action is. Then repeat if I have to.
Ilan, I've heard of S curves in necks but not M curves, sounds like maybe heat treating (or whatever you call it) is in order here.
John, I never detune my basses, I should have been more specific, I agree with you 100%. I leave it tuned and just back bow the neck a little to relieve the pressure from the strings on the TR's. After I tighten the nuts I release the pressure and check to see how the action is. Then repeat if I have to.
Ilan, I've heard of S curves in necks but not M curves, sounds like maybe heat treating (or whatever you call it) is in order here.
