Model of the Week 25: 4004Cii "Cheyenne II"

[jps]

Jared!!!

Stop looking at that bass like that!!!

[crazypink]

I so would love to have an early Cheyenne curly top with maple fretboard to add to my early 4004 collection, all of which have maple fretboards. It's the only 4004c curly maple top I've seen with a maple fretboard, which makes me wonder whether it's unique. Jeff is it an early model or was it custom made for the 75th Anniversary? Do you know when it dates from, and is it the only one produced with a maple fretboard?

[bassduke49]

Warren, if I may, that quilted-top Cheyenne with the maple fretboard appears to be a prototype in the development of the Cii series. All the field marks of the Cheyenne I are there except for the quilted front. This instrument is at the RIC office/museum, on display with many other unusual prototypes.

The initial Cii production examples appear to have the quilted fronts with bubinga fretboards and the lowered position of the pickups. It doesn't appear that there were many of these made before the construction switched to the maple/walnut/maple sandwich of today's standards. There were some sandwich bodies with highly figured maple for a while, but not with such vivid quilting as these early examples. So, yes, this one is likely a one-off, and is certainly unavailable to the marketplace.

[spongebob]

My cii is now my only Ric.

I had a couple of others - a Laredo 4004 and a couple of 4003s over recent years, but once I got myself a cii over from the US, TBH, the others didn't sound or feel as good.

It feels superb, and the sound is like the Ric sound I always heard on record - low, growly, and powerful.

I'm a big fan of the 4004's, and for me, the cii is the perfect Ric - it's certainly the best I've ever played, and once I played it, it really put me off 4003s, and even the 'lighter' Laredo tone - they are the ultimate!!!

[crazypink]

Paul, I was aware of the small production of the first issues of the Cii with the quilted fronts, which had the bubinga fretboards, but was interested about the two that I'd seen with the maple fretboard. Have you asked John Hall to clarify any of these points for your book, as we would then be a lot clearer. I do appreciate that RIC are very closed about the info that they give out or make available.

I have a photo from the RIC Museum of one with both control knobs missing, but the one that the female bassist from Mood Maiden is using, I assume is a different bass, which would indicate that two were made, and wonder if there are anymore. I would be interested to know if she owns that 4004c or whether it was lent to her to use at the 75th Anniversary gig. If she owns it, she's very lucky as you say, there can only be a few of those prototypes.

If only RIC would allow you to order a 4004 with a maple fretboard as an option, then I'd order a few, as I'm sure others would.

I also have a photo of an early 4004 in Fireglo, but I can't remember where I got the photo from. Interestingly it would appear to be a Laredo, but it has gold hardware, which would indicate it was a Cheyenne. I wonder if it's a prototype or a photo that was originally intended for publicity. (See photo attached) I would love to know more about this bass, and if it is actually a Cheyenne.

[bassduke49]

Warren, sorry for not making it clear. The bass played by the Moon Maiden IS the bass from the RIC musuem. It was provided for both stages at the 75th event, and the shots of the young lady are taken at both events. As far as I know (and, yes, RIC doesn't always surrender information easily), it is the only one that has the combination of quilted front and maple fretboard. If you examine the quilt pattern, you'll see that the shots of it on stage and the shot of it without knobs at rest next to the Lemmy show the same instrument. By the way, it isn't a glossy finish, more of a semigloss. Simply beautiful. Now that's not to say there is another (or more) out there, but there is no evidence of such at this time.

That Fireglo "Cheyenne" is simply an early Laredo with the chrome hardware swapped for gold. The truly defining feature between the Cheyenne and Laredo is not the hardware, but the body construction. Laredo's are all maple; Cheyennes have walnut - either body wings or sandwich "core."

Also, you might want to read more at the very first entry to this "Model of the Week" installment.

[crazypink]

Paul, you've made that all perfectly clear, thank you. I know your as interested as me to find out whether there were more of that early style Cheyenne produced. Like you the maple fretboard 4004's are my favourite in the 4004 range.

I could tell that the Fireglo 4004 was a Laredo, as the body looks like it's maple, but I wonder whether that's a RIC photo, or whether someone has either ordered it with gold hardware or changed it themselves, as a few have or are trying to be passed off as a Cheyenne. Do you know if RIC were open earlier on to custom orders on the Laredo and Cheyenne's?

It looks in some photos that I've seem, that the 2009 Cii's have all Maple bodies and have lost the Walnut core, does your new Cii Blueburst still have the Walnut core, and has the new Schaller bridge made any difference when playing, compared to the Combi? Have to say yours is stunning, RIC seems to have upped their game in the quality of the woods used, as the flame on yours is simply stunning, it almost looks like it's Spalted Maple.

Have you got far with your book?

[bassduke49]

I'm pretty sure that isn't a RIC photograph, and I don't know if RIC would honor a request to install the gold hardware on a Laredo. It certainly could be done as easily as the chrome, but they may not want to do that.

The first Cheyennes (4004C) were all walnut body wings with maple fretboards and no other colors would have been applied. When the Laredo debuted, the first year on the price list said "Jetglo only," but this restriction was not on the 2nd year price list. Any available color would have been eligible, supposedly, although I've never seen nor heard of any variety of 4004 in Sea Green (2000 COY) or Burgundy (2002), but have seen them in Desert Gold (2001), Montezuma Brown (2003-04) Blue Boy (2004), Blueburst (2005), and Amber Fireglo (2006). Obviously, after the initial batch of Cii's with the quilted fronts, the "Cheyenne only colors" of Trans(parent)Red, TransBlue, and TransGreen) were available.

No, the recent Cii's have the walnut core, but it may not be terribly evident in photos. Some walnut samples are lighter (in color) than others, but it's there in the Cii's.

I can't really tell any difference in the bridges, but I'm not one who plays these instruments so much that I would notice anyway. I do like the looks of the recent flamey maple.

The book is afloat, but "becalmed." I haven't pursued some of my sources as doggedly as I would like, and some are reticent to surrender information. So I continue to collect photos and information as it presents itself. I still hope to publish someday, and as soon as I get more cooperation from the folks in the know, I'll be able to speed up the process.

[crazypink]

Paul,

I really appreciate all the replies. I wonder why RIC has changer the quality of the flamey maple on the recent batch of Cii's, maybe it wasn't intentional, maybe they were just lucky and the wood turned up like that from their supplier.

It's going to be another year before I can afford to order a new Cii, and wonder what the waiting list will be like by they, and if the wait time may have come down. Probably not despite the streamlining. I wish more people in the UK would order the 4004's instead of the 4003, then more music stores might order and stock them.

You would have thought it would be in the interest of the folk in the know to contribute some info, for everyone to read about such a professional, quality luthier as they are.

I've notice on the Register that some guy in Colorado has ordered nine Cii's through Wildwood Guitars, which were all produced in November 2008, must have cost him a fortune! Lucky guy!

[cjj]

I've notice on the Register that some guy in Colorado has ordered nine Cii's through Wildwood Guitars, which were all produced in November 2008, must have cost him a fortune! Lucky guy!

I think that you'll notice that all those Colorado 4004Ciis are listed as "CI", which means the information was collected from a publicly available source, namely Wildwood's website. So, the "lucky guy" is merely the dealer...

[crazypink]

Thanks for clarifying that, I had wondered why those has CI IMG in the image section, and the other didn't.

[jnbass]

And a few more, they are stunning.

Those pics came from the Elderly website!

Stunning.

My own...

[jnbass]

Jared!!!

Stop looking at that bass like that!!!

sigh

[johnallg]

The one with the blue background..... sigh.....

[Darthbass]

Bassduke your blueburst is just about the most beautiful bass I have ever laid eyes upon---Im calling dibs right now should you ever need to sell that!


Now please excuse me while I go and change my underwear...