I’m a bit baffled by a popping/slapping effect when playing a 4001 (engraved on the truss rod cover), 84’ is penciled inside the control cavity. When played (with fingers) the sound is annoying, noticeable with the neck pu, more pronounced on the bridge pu. According to the owner, when recording he can’t get a clean sound at all. This bass has hi-gains and are set quite low. The round wound strings are old and should be replaced.
The owner is willing to replace the pu’s. I’d hate to swap them out and still have the popping/slapping sound. I’m at a deadend for ideas, please post some suggestions. Thanks, Jim.
4001 extreme growl......?
Moderator: jingle_jangle
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jwr2
try a compressor ... I have a bunch of Rics ... I don't have a pop slap sound problem with them ... A ric is not as clean as some active basses ... it is more growlly like a p-bass ... for instance some of the new active basses are too clean and lack personality ... I like a dirty sound like Geddy Lee or Chris Squire ... your bass may need a set up, it probably needs new strings ... maybe there is a problem with the pickups/electronics ... find another ric and see if it sounds the same or better or worse ... also play through the right amp with the right settings ...
It could be simply a matter of playing....i often play way harder than i think i am, especially fingerstyle. But yes a set up would not hurt. Also strings sometimes get a bit looser when really old so try a new set.
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If the PU's are set low I doubt it's the strings hitting the pickups, and if it's both PU's that do it it sounds like something electrical especially since it is more pronounced with the treble pickup, (is louder and more trebly). It could be something as simple as the output jack having dirty contacts, could be a bad soldier joint on one of the output jacks. Try putting a cord in the stereo jack, if it stops it is probably the contacts on the mono jack (you will only get the treble pickup with a mono cord in the stereo jack). Bang the bass do you hear a crackling noise? Are the pots dirty? Are the pickups clean when played softly, do you still get this sound with a pick? If not maybe Owen is right, but usually only the bass PU gets hit with the strings, especially if they are low (PU's)
I don't think it is the pickups, for them to both go bad at the same time would be quite a coincidence. Are they unusually soft? How low is the action? You are not hitting the last fret with the strings are you? Check around inside for loose wires and bad soldier joints if none of these things work. Is the three way switch crackly? Does it do it with the switch in all positions? Does it do it with the pickups even lower, so that it is impossible to hit them with the strings?
I don't think it is the pickups, for them to both go bad at the same time would be quite a coincidence. Are they unusually soft? How low is the action? You are not hitting the last fret with the strings are you? Check around inside for loose wires and bad soldier joints if none of these things work. Is the three way switch crackly? Does it do it with the switch in all positions? Does it do it with the pickups even lower, so that it is impossible to hit them with the strings?
Do Ricks have problems with staticy pickguards like Telecasters seem to? Maybe that could be part of the problem. I've had occassional crackle/pop type noises from my Tele and had to wipe the pickguard down with a dryer sheet. It's probably a long shot in this case, but if all else fails it may be worth a shot. What about the ground wire to the bridge?
Id say its playing style: I play quite hard and often hit the highest fret with the strings by accident and i dont use really low action at all. This happens to me with fingers, pick , wotever. Its worse on my P bass, but then thats a worse bass
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Thanks for all the responses. I've already replaced the jacks with a new Ric O Sound assembly. I did suspect fret buzzing high up the neck. When I played it the feel wasn't bad. I'll measure the action and and check the relief more closely. The strings aren't hitting the pickups, horseshoe has been removed. I didn't want to do a setup with the old strings, the owner hasn't approved installing new strings yet. I suspect something electrical is going on. The owner removed the string mute, maybe something happening in the bridge. I don't have the bass here to check out, maybe I can drive in to the shop tomorrow. Again thanks for your help, I'll continue to post as this unfolds.
Bingo. If the mute (the actual metal plate and thumb screws) was removed , the strings are not grounded into the circuit.
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But that should not cause the sound he described and actually there should be no noise as you took your hand off and on the bass. There would probably be a little more continues buzz as the strings and string assembly would act like a little antenna for electrical noise. I think Sérgios basses are like that and he has never complained about any noise like that.
If I hit my last fret from playing too hard I get more of a clicking sound. But then again you never now and it should be grounded for safety's sake and less noise anyway. (If you have a grounded system as does the US and most of the rest of the civilized world (except of course Lima where we have 220 with no ground at all, talk about buzz!) I would check the pots and tone control caps and switch, usually dirty sound can be traced to open resistors and a pot is just a variable resistor and a dirty switch has resistance when it shouldn't at all.
If I hit my last fret from playing too hard I get more of a clicking sound. But then again you never now and it should be grounded for safety's sake and less noise anyway. (If you have a grounded system as does the US and most of the rest of the civilized world (except of course Lima where we have 220 with no ground at all, talk about buzz!) I would check the pots and tone control caps and switch, usually dirty sound can be traced to open resistors and a pot is just a variable resistor and a dirty switch has resistance when it shouldn't at all.
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big_g
I have had one of the truss rods rattle and that rattle can be loud enough to be transmitted to the pickups, since they are passive single coils.
Jeff addressed the compressor issue, since the single coil pickups are one magnet per string that makes for a pickup that is extreme in the peaks and weaker in the more sustained lagging part of the notes. The single coil Precision's had that problem, Leo decided to split the magnets and put them off center where the string rested in the overlap area and during its travel would only rotate slightly into the main magnetic window of either one of the two slugs when vibrating. This is why the effective use of good compressors can help your sound by knocking off some of the peak energy and allowing the rest of the note seem stronger by comparison.
There is one other thing to consider, the 4001 treble pickup chrome ring does get struck a lot during aggressive playing, I kind of like it, some don't. This is why the 4003's have a cut away in their pickup surround. You could get him to look at getting one of those if he doesn't seem to like the string clanging on it a bit.
But to let me say this again, check the truss rods, they balance against each other, you can have one tight and the other loose enough to make an annoying rattling and buzzing when he plays. Usually it will happen more when the 3rd and 4th strings vibrate, because they have stronger resonant harmonic frequencies.
Jeff addressed the compressor issue, since the single coil pickups are one magnet per string that makes for a pickup that is extreme in the peaks and weaker in the more sustained lagging part of the notes. The single coil Precision's had that problem, Leo decided to split the magnets and put them off center where the string rested in the overlap area and during its travel would only rotate slightly into the main magnetic window of either one of the two slugs when vibrating. This is why the effective use of good compressors can help your sound by knocking off some of the peak energy and allowing the rest of the note seem stronger by comparison.
There is one other thing to consider, the 4001 treble pickup chrome ring does get struck a lot during aggressive playing, I kind of like it, some don't. This is why the 4003's have a cut away in their pickup surround. You could get him to look at getting one of those if he doesn't seem to like the string clanging on it a bit.
But to let me say this again, check the truss rods, they balance against each other, you can have one tight and the other loose enough to make an annoying rattling and buzzing when he plays. Usually it will happen more when the 3rd and 4th strings vibrate, because they have stronger resonant harmonic frequencies.
There was a guy in another column that had that problem with one of the truss rods but he described it as a rattle,
One of the things I like about these pickups is there intiial attack, especially when plucked hard, I get some pleasant distortion but no annoying noise. I especially like my treble pickup close to the strings just for this reason.
Usually a popping snapping noise is caused by a bad resistor somewhere, the electricity on the initial attack is strong enough to jump the gap but when it starts to decay it dies. I've seen this problem in many amps and old radios.
A good old oscilloscope would work wonders here. You can trace the signal path from the pickups right on out of the bass and see where there is an abrupt change.
One of the things I like about these pickups is there intiial attack, especially when plucked hard, I get some pleasant distortion but no annoying noise. I especially like my treble pickup close to the strings just for this reason.
Usually a popping snapping noise is caused by a bad resistor somewhere, the electricity on the initial attack is strong enough to jump the gap but when it starts to decay it dies. I've seen this problem in many amps and old radios.
A good old oscilloscope would work wonders here. You can trace the signal path from the pickups right on out of the bass and see where there is an abrupt change.
Update........
I've check ground continuity, tests ok. All solder joints appear good. The Ric'O Sound jacks were replaced. Snugged up the truss rods a bit more. Action is adequate to rule out fret buzzing. The strings clear the pu's. The owner opted to replace the strings and intonate himself, forgoing a complete setup. After the new strings are installed, the electronics will be further investigated if buzz/pop still exists.
The only additional observervation I can add at this time is the pronounced neck vibration felt when playing. Much more than felt with my v63. My assumption for "84" I think is wrong, closer to 89/90. I'll check the Serial # and do a search. If it comes back in I'll check the caps and pots for resistance. I'll also be looking for a schematic when the manuf. date is established.
Thanks again for the responses.
I've check ground continuity, tests ok. All solder joints appear good. The Ric'O Sound jacks were replaced. Snugged up the truss rods a bit more. Action is adequate to rule out fret buzzing. The strings clear the pu's. The owner opted to replace the strings and intonate himself, forgoing a complete setup. After the new strings are installed, the electronics will be further investigated if buzz/pop still exists.
The only additional observervation I can add at this time is the pronounced neck vibration felt when playing. Much more than felt with my v63. My assumption for "84" I think is wrong, closer to 89/90. I'll check the Serial # and do a search. If it comes back in I'll check the caps and pots for resistance. I'll also be looking for a schematic when the manuf. date is established.
Thanks again for the responses.