660/12 Lefty set-up questions

[RicukStu]

Hello Guys
I'm new to this forum and this is my first post. I am now the proud owner of a lefty 2005 660/12 Blueboy. It was shipped from the US to the UK and for some reason the sender slackened the strings before sending it
When I tuned it for the first time I found various problems with the set-up. There is a bow in the neck and the intonation is all out, there is fret buzz on the high octave G string, the action is far too high. It is just impossible to play the guitar in it's current state
I am very wary of doing anything to it myself even though I've been playing guitar for 20+ years, Rickenbackers are far too delicate for an amateur. Would you recommend I take it to my local guitar shop to be set-up properly, I'm just a bit unsure as to how much they would know about Rickenbacker set-up. Any advice would be very much appreciated. I have included some pictures to show you what I mean.

Bridge height


Action at nut


Action at 12th fret

[jingle_jangle]

Stuart,

The nut looks like the factory setup, and could use taking down just a bit--only about .010" or .25mm. I'd leave it for the time being.

1. I know you'd love to play it, but unless you take it to somebody who really knows Ricks, chances are you will end up with zero progress. In the end, you want the bridge to be about 1/16" (1.5mm) lower than it is in the photo, and still you want to have good action, with maybe about 1.5-2mm string gap at the end of the fretboard, with the neck straight or with very little relief.

2. I recommend that you first check the tension on the truss rod nuts. If they're not snugged up, that's a good deal of your problem. Snug them up to where you can feel the friction, and then another 1/2 turn. Now, let the guitar acclimate for a week or two. Waiting is the hardest part. Leave it strung and tuned to pitch.

3. During the acclimation period, check the neck after a few days. Is it straightening towards a zero-relief situation? After a week or so, if it isn't looking straighter, give the nuts another 1/4 turn. You'll need to check the straightness of the neck every day or two. You've got to sneak up on it, 1/4 turn at a time.

5. Don't use anything but a screwdriver-type nutdriver with a 1/4" socket, to tighten the nuts. Using a ratchet or anything else that multiplies torque can lead to stripped or broken rods or a popped fretboard.

If you do decide to take it to a tech, make sure he knows how to read, then hand him a printed copy of the above. Make him vow to follow it to the letter, and tell him you want him to take his time. Most techs (if you can even get them to agree to work on one) will treat a Rickenbacker 12 string like a Fender or Gibson, and expect to be able to adjust the truss rods in one sitting. They'll invariably over-tighten the rods.

[RicukStu]

Thanks Paul
Thats really great advice and so quick too, I contacted the seller and told him about my situation and he's offered to pay for a professional set-up. I'm just unsure if the guitar was in the same condition as when he shipped it. He did assure me that the neck was 'dead straight' before I purchased it but slackening the strings fully before shipping it by air to the UK would really affect the guitar would it not?
I really wish there was a Rickenbacker guitar tech in my area that could sort it out, so if anyone in the UK knows someone in the West Midlands area please let me know.

Thanks again

[jingle_jangle]

Unfortunately, lots of people believe that slackening the strings is the only safe way to ship a 12-string. This is patently untrue. The neck structure of a 12-string guitar is reliant on three forces to retain stability.

The wooden neck itself (1) is, in effect, a tube which becomes a compression member as it resists and counteracts the tension of the strings (2) on one side and the truss rods (3) on the other. Changing the balance, by removing one of these forces (in this case, string tension) can cause the neck to go out of whack in the time the instrument was in transit, especially considering the temperature and humidity changes inherent in transoceanic shipping.

Sure, a shipper could loosen the strings AND the truss rod nuts, but then the buyer would have to start again with a fresh setup, which can try the patience of an owner who is not a tech.

I wish I could recommend a good Rick tech in the West Midlands, but perhaps one of our UK members can step up here with some assistance.

[RicukStu]

Just got back from seeing a Rick guitar tech who snugged up the truss rods, adjusted the bridge, changed the strings and sorted out the intonation. It now plays like a totally different guitar, a 100% improvement. He did say however that the string spacing is wrong at the nut. He said it didn't look like a proper 660/12 nut, it also seemed to be held in place only by the truss rod cover.
After some quick research I found the correct part number from the official Rickenbacker which is 03328 Nut, 12 string, W/ binding
The nut on my 660/12 has no binding so could anyone confirm that it is the correct nut or not, here's a picture of my guitar.

[wmthor]

... The nut on my 660/12 has no binding so could anyone confirm that it is the correct nut or not, ...

Stuart, congratulations on your 660/12 LH BB. I just took a look at my '08 660/12 LH FG and it appears to have the same nut as yours.

660_12 Headstock.jpg

[jps]

.....I found the correct part number from the official Rickenbacker which is 03328 Nut, 12 string, W/ binding
The nut on my 660/12 has no binding so could anyone confirm that it is the correct nut or not, here's a picture of my guitar.

The description refers to the neck binding, nuts never have binding on them.

[beatlefreak]

Welcome to the forum. If the guitar is now playing and feeling right, I'd leave well enough alone. Enjoy!

[jingle_jangle]

Just got back from seeing a Rick guitar tech who snugged up the truss rods, adjusted the bridge, changed the strings and sorted out the intonation. It now plays like a totally different guitar, a 100% improvement. He did say however that the string spacing is wrong at the nut. He said it didn't look like a proper 660/12 nut, it also seemed to be held in place only by the truss rod cover.
After some quick research I found the correct part number from the official Rickenbacker which is 03328 Nut, 12 string, W/ binding
The nut on my 660/12 has no binding so could anyone confirm that it is the correct nut or not, here's a picture of my guitar.

There are two separate Rick 12 string nuts. Of course, neither has binding. One fits current 330/12s and 360/12s; the other the 660/12, which has a wider neck. It's possible that the nut that was on it when you took it to the tech, was the too-narrow 330/12-360/12 one, hence his comment. As long as the total width of the nut is neither too long (it sticks out) or too short (there is space on either side of it), and the strings feel OK to you to play, you're golden.

[grazioso]

Unfortunately, lots of people believe that slackening the strings is the only safe way to ship a 12-string. This is patently untrue. The neck structure of a 12-string guitar is reliant on three forces to retain stability.

The wooden neck itself (1) is, in effect, a tube which becomes a compression member as it resists and counteracts the tension of the strings (2) on one side and the truss rods (3) on the other. Changing the balance, by removing one of these forces (in this case, string tension) can cause the neck to go out of whack in the time the instrument was in transit, especially considering the temperature and humidity changes inherent in transoceanic shipping.

Sure, a shipper could loosen the strings AND the truss rod nuts, but then the buyer would have to start again with a fresh setup, which can try the patience of an owner who is not a tech.

I wish I could recommend a good Rick tech in the West Midlands, but perhaps one of our UK members can step up here with some assistance.

i am one of those inferior people that think that it is patently true to rather ship ANY guitar with loose strings. my - as of today -still unfinished fedex claim process from the march of 2009 - when they broke the headstock on my 65 360/12 - is more than enough for me to rather to go through extra setup procedure after the shipping than to be proud owner of another broken guitar. it is likely than any guitar shipped overseas would have to go through complete setup anyway due to humidity differences and personal favorite setup of new owner.

[jingle_jangle]

Never inferred that you were "inferior", Dusan, so I hope you intended it as humor!

I've shipped literally hundreds of guitars--electric, acoustic, bass--over the last four years, with every major carrier, to every single continent on this planet except Africa. My reasoning for not messing with the forces of balance is explained very clearly in my post above. Besides that reasoning, I've got to cite experiences as well--not one broken neck or headstock. Full disclosure: I have shipped a solid body which suffered a slight wing separation, but that had nothing to do with string tension.

However, customers have shipped guitars with the string tension slacked, to me and others, and I've seen, heard, and repaired some of these horror stories.

So, basically, though there are generally more than two sides to every story, in this case my opinion and advice has a lot of science and experience as backup.

[grazioso]

me and humor ? impossible !

[jingle_jangle]

Dusan you are infamous!!! Of course!!!

[RutleDirk]

...However, customers have shipped guitars with the string tension slacked, to me and others, and I've seen, heard, and repaired some of these horror stories...

Ooh! I love a good horror story! Perhaps you might treat us to one of these?

[jingle_jangle]

I hope it won't compromise my credibility if I don't share these stories; it would be most disingenuous...

Generally, though, people do stuff sometimes without thinking it out; still others will typically over-think stuff obsessively, and still come to the wrong conclusions. It's all human nature.

When customers actually ask me for shipping tips (and many do), I always tell them to leave the instrument tuned, as part of the instructions.