When did Ric switch between Grovers / Kluson Tuners?

[Grey]

Theres a 1973 Fireglo 480 on eBay right now which has Grover tuners. To my knolwedge Grovers were like the "deluxe" model and were used on the 481. This is the second 480 i've seen with these types of tuners.

Can anyone identify what specific model these are?

http://photos.imageevent.com/olivias/73 ... %20037.JPG

http://photos.imageevent.com/olivias/73 ... %20052.JPG

EDIT: I have made a massive fail, since I just noticed the leftover holes from the Klusons on the back of the headstock. Still, i've seen these on the 481 models.

[jdogric12]

Good question. I'm not sure. I had a 76 450 with K's and an '81 360 with G's. Anyone care to help me narrow it down further? Maybe I should search some pics in the register...

[libratune]

I believe the switch was first made in 1971 and started with the 360 6-string models.

Here's a 360 bound headstock from Sept. 1971 with Grovers: http://www.rickresource.com/register/vi ... lebrity%3D

There'a a May 1971 360 bound headstock on the Register with Klusons.

I believe that the 360 6-strings after 1971 were issued with Grovers. The time period for phasing in Grovers on other models may differ.

[jdogric12]

Just remembered: my bandmate's 81 620/12 has Klusons. And I had an 81 450/12 with Klusons once. I imagine the Klusons were used for the 12 strings and Grovers were used for 6 strings, because I had a 78 362 with both.

[Grey]

Were the Grovers better than the 'Kluson Deluxe' tuners? I was never quite sure why they used the grovers on the 481's but not the 480's, and their years in production overlapped so it must have been by choice to use one over the other.

[libratune]

I believe that Grovers were considered an "upgrade" from the Klusons.

It appears that RIC generally switched to Grovers on its 360-12 models sometime in 1983. Here's pics of the back of two 360-12 headstocks showing Klusons on the August '83 and Grovers with "Kluson sized" tuning buttons on the December '83:

Then notice how the size of the tuning buttons increased to the "full Grover" half-moon on these 1985 and 1986 360-12 examples:

[Kilaen]

Here's a response from John Hall himself:

Subject: Grover Tuners

Date: 1998/08/29

Question: I have a 1987 320 JG with Grover tuners. My 1987 620 FG has Schallers. My 1997 360 also has the "Made in Germany" stamp on the tuners. When did Ric switch tuners?

Answer: Unfortunately, there's no precise date for the switch as stocks of different brands and types of keys have existed until differerent points in time. But more generally speaking, we had some quality issues with Grover and subsequently found out that major parts of these keys were being produced in Taiwan or Korea (I forget which . . .). I told Rich Berger, their CEO, that I would never order an Asian key again, as a result. In actuality, I wasn't able to keep that promise entirely, as the best reproduction "Kluson Deluxe" keys were coming from Gotoh in Japan and we really had no choice but to use them. But as soon as I convinced Helmut Schaller to make some changes in his version of that key for the sake of authenticity, we immediately switched our business to Schaller in Germany.

As found on the John Hall Answers Questions section of the website.