REM Broke Up!!!

[Ain'tGotNoPokemon]

Another aspect of Peter's later sound is that he's not usually playing totally clean. For example, on "Texarkana," he has a beautiful chime, but with a touch of overdrive. Then, even later, on "Electron Blue," you can hear slight drive on his chorus part. When I had my 360, I sounded the most like Peter when I had my Fender HRD's drive channel on 4. It gives more natural definition to the notes.

[electrofaro]

Interesting. I doubt Peter only plays in the middle, I also doubt he only plays on bridge pick-up either. I know Peter uses both from seeing them live. Does Peter ever use it on neck only though?

How many pedals did Peter use in the early to mid 80s? When they moved to larger venues, did he start using more/different pedals?

[Sweden]

Those two pic you posted: It's in the treble position.

Are you serious?

As for the Mike thing: It's my hypothesis. If you don't wanna believe it, that's your prerogative.

I agree with your hypothesis to a certain degree. I just didn't think those pictures proved anything.

I think maybe the issue is that you seem so convinced that you are correct in everything that relates to Peter's guitars and playing that you aren't really open to understanding that others may have spent just as much time and effort as you have in figuring out stuff, and that those persons may have come to different conclusions than you have or even have have greater knowledge than you have. That position of yours doesn't really provide for very efficient discussion unfortunately, and I think it's a shame. I really do.

And Robert, as regards the whole pickup selection thing and his evolvement of sound, it's still not unlikely that he may have used the treble pickup with the purpose to cut through in the mix through ****** PA's and cramped venues at certain points during the 80's. I would also argue that the switch from Fender to Vox makes up for a lot of the difference between, say, 1985 and 2005. While the Vox has a bite, the top shimmer is lost. He's also playing with a larger amount of distorsion on a lot of stuff from the Olympia than he ever did on those songs during the 80's. In 83-85 his sound on the songs from that very era is extremely clear and un-distorted. As for pedals, we know that he's used the Ibanez multieffect all since 83 or so, and it is still around, but the other pedals have changed over time. A treble boost was seen in the photos from 2005.

Werner, I have never seen him change pickups at any time when I've seen them live, nor have I ever heard him do it on video or tape apart from what sounds like an obvious occurence on the b-side Time after Time/So. Central Rain. It's a bit odd, but I also find myself working almost exclusively with the middle position on my 360. Minor changes can be done with the blend knob, but apart from that, no.

/David

[electrofaro]

Werner, I have never seen him change pickups at any time when I've seen them live, nor have I ever heard him do it on video or tape apart from what sounds like an obvious occurence on the b-side Time after Time/So. Central Rain. It's a bit odd, but I also find myself working almost exclusively with the middle position on my 360. Minor changes can be done with the blend knob, but apart from that, no.

Well, it's true that Peter hardly ever changes any knob setting during a gig. As for the PU selector, he doesn't move it often. In recent years Peter's sound live has been a lot the same on every song. I doubt his selector switch is malfunctioning so you actually hear him switch it.

When I started playing EH, I was on bridge, now I'm dialed in on both, fully open, plus the mixer in middle.

Did a Pokemon and quickly Googled, the results:

PU selector on middle, and every knob fully open, and possibly the blend in the middle setting.
http://www.peoplequiz.com/images/bios/p ... g-3708.jpg

His 12er he has on bridge:
http://multimedia.pol.dk/archive/00494/ ... 94092a.jpg

No further sign of the 360 being on bridge, only on middle settings, but all the big clear pictures are 2007 and later!

Just for laughs:
http://www.superiorpics.com/wenn_album/ ... 210908.jpg

[Sweden]

Well, it's true that Peter hardly ever changes any knob setting during a gig. As for the PU selector, he doesn't move it often. In recent years Peter's sound live has been a lot the same on every song. I doubt his selector switch is malfunctioning so you actually hear him switch it.
When I started playing EH, I was on bridge, now I'm dialed in on both, fully open, plus the mixer in middle.
Did a Pokemon and quickly Googled, the results:
PU selector on middle, and every knob fully open, and possibly the blend in the middle setting.
http://www.peoplequiz.com/images/bios/p ... g-3708.jpg
His 12er he has on bridge:
http://multimedia.pol.dk/archive/00494/ ... 94092a.jpg
No further sign of the 360 being on bridge, only on middle settings, but all the big clear pictures are 2007 and later!

Interesting to see the 12 being on bridge!

I think the concept of middle position/"fully open" is otherwise pretty important to Peter's sound, at least in the last 20 years or so, with the obvious aspect of compression being used of course. For both the orange Gretsch and the black Tele Custom it's clear he used the middle position as he even taped the switch selector in middle position while on stage as to not move them accidentially when playing. Look at the '84 Pretty Persuasion clip from Old Grey Whistle Test for example. Not sure about the Les Paul though, here it looks like bridge position maybe: http://imagehost.vendio.com/a/35033762/ ... REM__1.jpg

/David

[electrofaro]

Does the Rockpalast video give any clues how he had the switch at that gig?

Getty has PLB on bridge PU - and we don't have to argue from when that was, as it's obvious.

http://www.gettyimages.nl/detail/85842772/Redferns

As for Teles, he's not always had that taped:

http://www.gettyimages.nl/detail/129361 ... on-Archive

[Sweden]

Getty has PLB on bridge PU - and we don't have to argue from when that was, as it's obvious.
http://www.gettyimages.nl/detail/85842772/Redferns
As for Teles, he's not always had that taped:
http://www.gettyimages.nl/detail/129361 ... on-Archive

Cool! Good finds. It's worth noting how much 330 we're finding in the 82-85 period. I have never owned a 330 so wouldn't know if there would be a general reason for going with bridge there. Same PU and main construction, so I doubt they are inherently less treble-y. But we've yet to see a picture of the 360 within anything else than the middle position in clear sight, right? But I believe the main idea of some bridge PU indeed being used live in the early 80's makes sense, for the cut through mix aspects I mentioned above.

As for the Tele, apart from the fact that it's non the black Custom that's May 1980...he probably had very limited ideas on how we actually wanted to sound at that point... But a good spot nonetheless! In the 84 ones you see it's taped.

Have those pics from Memorial Hall 1980 even surfaced before? Mike is playing a Hofner! Quite a find, Werner.

/David

[electrofaro]

Just the Saturday afternoon bright moment to try image database like Getty.

You're right about the black Tele being taped down, although I wouldnt dare guess in which position!

I never saw the Memorial Hall pictures before at any rate. They were actually on the last page for a search on Peter Buck. I thought Getty would provide more evidence and better quality pictures than Google, even though they're smaller sized. Google images is getting worse and worse - whatever you search for it's always pr0n you find, imo!

I checked out the Rockpalast video and it seems he's got the selector switch on middle on both the 330 BG and 340 MG. Is he using the 340 on songs where he used to play the Tele live? The sound is not that different between the two, imo, so why change guitar?

Most pictures still show Peter using the 360 with the selector on middle position, even for the 80s. So I guess it's fair to say he's got it on that position for most songs he does live with the 360.

[electrofaro]

Anyway, digging for answers I found these scans of record company promo pictures:

[marc61]

I must be blind, or you guys are talking about something else. In the pics and the video, it appears the pickup selector is in the middle. How the knobs are dialed up? That I can't tell.

[Sweden]

I must be blind, or you guys are talking about something else. In the pics and the video, it appears the pickup selector is in the middle. How the knobs are dialed up? That I can't tell.

Not sure which pictures you are referring to, but if mine then yes, thaty was my impression too. There are a few 330 pictures from the 80's that have been posted where he has it in bridge position, but I would say we are yet to find a picture of the 360 in anything other than middle position.

Anytime I have been close enough to see, which has actually only been at side band shows where he has played the backup 360, the pots have all been fully open and the blend knob mid-way. But it seems the same applies for the main Rick with R.E.M. as well.

/David

[Ain'tGotNoPokemon]

In the pics and video it looks to me that he mostly has the bridge on. It doesn't sound like he has both on, especially if you take your own Ric, pump up the neck pickup, and see how bassy it sounds. His is very bright. You forget that I was the one who brought up the middle position theory; I just believe he played more lead pickup in the eighties. I COULD be wrong, and WOULD admit so if I thought I was wrong.

Sweden: That's all I'm going to say on that. I've read a lot of forums, done a lot of research, and listened to a lot of live stuff. I don't claim to know everything about Peter's guitar work, but I think I know enough. The pictures provided aren't close up enough to tell, by the way. I'm in no competition with you, Sweden. I don't care to effectively discuss anything with you because of your attitude towards me - From the very beginning of this thread, as you recall, you decided to make me out as a freak. So, to basically call me a stubborn know it all, in your position, would be acceptable, because I don't really want to have anything to do with you. I'm more than happy to speak to others about Peter, and even apologized in another thread about a heated discussion we had over a model Peter was playing in a live video. I'm not at all unwilling to discuss something, but I simply don't like your style. I didn't when I was on Murmurs, either. Sorry to be a jerk.

Marc, I don't think we can see close enough to tell how his setting are setup. I have tried zooming in on photos, but it gets too fuzzy to tell. I have some REM books with good pictures that I'll scope out right now...

Reveal The Story of R.E.M.: Page 83: The pickup selector of the 360 is taped down. Page 123: Peter has the 330, but it's a photo shoot - The pickup selector is in the middle, and the fifth knob is (If you're looking at the guitar and not holding it) is at 11-oclock, but ALL of the other knobs are turned ALL THE WAY OFF. Page 133: The same 330 (Different photoshoot) shows Peter with the knob in the exact same position, and all the other knobs, again, are all the way off.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NwzxvxKB ... re=related - This video shows the taped down selector - However, like the photos/videos already posted, we don't see clearly or close enough to determine. Again, it sounds like it is, and, to my eyes, looks like it is. If I had my Ric 360 still, I'd make a video to show how bassy it is with both pickups and the blend knob up higher. To me, anything past 3 o clock (9 if you're looking down at the guitar) sounds too muddy/bassy to be like Peter Buck.

[rkbsound]

I am most amused by this discussion. Interesting theories, yes. Not interesting enough to get all heated up about it.

[Ain'tGotNoPokemon]

Not interesting enough to get all heated up about it.

I'm not heated at all. I am just not a fan of... Well, I believe it takes two to tango, and in this case, I am letting my feelings be known, and letting it drop. You won't be seeing any more hostility from me in this thread.

[Folkie]

Thanks for the clarification, David. I had speculated that Peter used to play "Pretty Persuasion" on what looked like a Tele Thinline, but you correctly identified the guitar as a black Tele Custom. That's the one on the 1984 Old Grey Whistle Test footage and on the Raleigh, NC stuff circa 1985.