Wanting more output = different pickups..?? Solutions please

[leftybass]

I would like to get more output (signal) out of my '79 4001. The bass is still stock with the factory high gains--the only thing I have ever done is replace the two jackplugs due to wear over the years.

Every other bass I have ever owned (other 4001s included) have had more output than my '79. So---

Is the answer to swap out the pickups for something newer...? I'm sure others have ran into this, so gimme some truth as Lennon said years ago...Thank you in advance..

[rickenbrother]

You can have someone like Sergio rewind the existing pickups or you can replace them with newer hi gains...or for something totally different, some HB1's. If you did go with newer higains, I'd also go for the new 4003 wiring harness, if you went for HB1's, I'd go for 500K pots.

[hieronymous]

I've got a '76 4001 and the pickups are very low output. But there's something about THE SOUND! Can you use a clean boost or a preamp? Are you trying to match the volumes between different basses for switching while playing live? Some effects units let you program different volume settings for different instruments. The recent Source Audio Programmable EQ springs to mind. Whatever you do, don't put Seymour Duncans in it! That's what I did - not sure why I thought it would be a good idea - ripped them out within 24 hours after putting them in!

I would think that replacing the pickups or having them rewound would change the sound.

[leftybass]

You can have someone like Sergio rewind the existing pickups or you can replace them with newer hi gains...or for something totally different, some HB1's. If you did go with newer higains, I'd also go for the new 4003 wiring harness, if you went for HB1's, I'd go for 500K pots.

Joey: One thought I've had is to have a ready-to-go setup to mount into the bass, i.e. new wiring harness and pickups on a pickguard. In the interest of originality, I am not inclined to alter anything too drastic like doing a p/up rewind.

What challenges me is that every other bass I own has a hotter output, and I don't see why my 'ol '79 can't be the same way. I've never measured the resistance of the orignal p/ups, maybe I should.

[rickenbrother]

You could always try a pedal that would boost your gain. Then you're not messing with the the originality of your 4001.

[paologregorio]

If there is enough clearance inside the p/up routs underneath the p/up, you could also attach a ceramic bar magnet under each p/up for a hotter output; no modification required; the magnet will just stick to the existing magnet on the underside of the magnet. I've done this for the bridge p/up on a couple of my Ricks, with great success.

[rickenbrother]

If there is enough clearance inside the p/up routs underneath the p/up, you could also attach a ceramic bar magnet under each p/up for a hotter output; no modification required; the magnet will just stick to the existing magnet on the underside of the magnet. I've done this for the bridge p/up on a couple of my Ricks, with great success.

Info like this is why we keep you around!
Got a source for the magnets?

[johnallg]

John, measure the windings. They should be around 8.4k ohms (8400 ohms). If they are a lot less, they could be partially shorted. Another thought would be to bypass the .0047uF in line with the bridge pup to volume pot connection. No one mentioned that yet.

[cassius987]

Got a source for the magnets?

They sell them at hardware stores in all sorts of sizes. I would think any magnet that covered the entire horizontal length and was even strength all the way across, without being too strong, would be great. I did this mod to a neck pickup once.

[songdog]

I would like to get more output (signal) out of my '79 4001. The bass is still stock with the factory high gains... Is the answer to swap out the pickups for something newer...?

1. The reissue horseshoe is HOT! If you're thinking about new pickups, try one of those. P.S. - looks cool too!

2. I run a two channel tube mic preamp in front of my Ampeg SVT-3Pro, one channel for my 4001, the other for my ... other ... bass. This lets me balance the levels between them (and push the Ampeg preamp a little harder if I want to).

[Tigger]

Hey John, I bought a MapleGlo 4001 in 1976 that had the most feeble output imaginable – absolutely stock, with "mushroom head" Hi-Gains. I used to bleed trying to get enough level out of that bass, and it didn't provide the McCartney/Quaife/Calvert tone I was seeking – no body, just a prominent but thin top end. I was very disappointed with the axe and parted company with it quite rapidly, replacing it with a fretless Precision that had heaps more stoke.

However, after years of unfulfilled lust for that classic Rickenbacker tone, I bought a couple of near-pristine second-hand 4001V63s in February, and they not only deliver the classic Rick tone but are also, despite some pick-up issues, way hot! My experience based on my feeble 1976 4001 was that Ricks just couldn't match it with Fenders for output, but my current experiences is that Fenders can't match it with Ricks – if using my fretted or fretless Jazzes, I have to crank the volume pot on my SVT significantly higher to achieve the same levels as with either of my 4001V63s.

The toasters have a delightful hollow fatness (if that makes sense!) but still with that Rick top end, the combination position is my default setting (despite some balance issues with the horseshoe pick-ups on both basses, for which I've bought contemporary replacements from Pick Of The Ricks, yet to install), and I haven't made much use of the soloed horseshoe thus far due to the previously mentioned balance issues. I'll be very interested to see whether the contemporary horshoes redress the balance issues, but there is no shortage of stoke as is, believe me!

I've read comment on RRF and the Rickenbacker site that contemporary Hi-Gains are genuinely high output, so I'd suggest the possibility of replacing the original units with contemporary Hi-Gains if you're after a more modern tone, or with toaster and horsehoe units if you're after a more vintage '60s tone, which is what I was seeking for so long and am now relishing.

[ken_j]

...Got a source for the magnets?

http://www.magnetsource.com/Solutions_P ... lnico.html

I would purchase a polarity tester to make sure you install them correctly.
http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Electronics ... ester.html

[cassius987]

But if they stick together you've basically got the same polarity/orientation no?

[ken_j]

But if they stick together you've basically got the same polarity/orientation no?

Depends if you want to stack them and make the pickup taller or put two on the edges to keep the profile lower, or simply replace the original.

[iiipopes]

Remember on the reissue basses that part of the "hollowness" of the neck tone is the 1/2 inch placement instead of the 1-inch placement, and that the toasters, having slugs under the cover closer together (six of them), has a smoother magnetic field and less transient response than the button tops of the high gains focusing the magnetic field.

More output? With what tone? There's always the HB-1 option, but on a 4001, the baseplate is not drilled for installation like a new 4003 is, so it would be more involved, and such. I'm almost positive that if you replace the entire pickup units, that they will screw in with the existing hardware, and only involve unsoldering the hot and ground at the point they go to the selector switch, so it doesn't involve much that can't be reversed and the original pickups reinstalled if that is desired.

Where do you have the pregain set on your amp? If at any point you get distortion in turning up the pregain, then you have enough pickup output, and it is an amplifier issue in the matching of the pregain and postgain (master volume) stages, not a pickup issue.

Another thing is strings: nickel TI's have the least magnetic properties; stainless steel Rotosounds have the most, with some variation in between depending on brand and gauge. The more magnetically interactive the string, the more output.

And, how far are the pickups from the strings? Output varies as the square of the distance of the pickup from the strings, so adjusting the pickups just a little bit closer will make a significant difference in output.

As I recall, the '76 4001 I used to own never had any output issues. I'm with the above: take a meter and read the pickups. If they are not in the 8 to 9 kohm range, then they may need to be rewound.

I disagree with adding the magnet for this reason: the magnetic field will oversaturate the coil, dropping impedance even more, and cause a harsh tone, not necessarily more output.