400 Series?

[xcoyle]

I bought two early 425 Combos last year and I am trying to date them. Serial numbers are similar but one seems older than the other.

Older one, which I think is a 1958 has serial number 4 C902. This one has the metal circle in the back, v notches on either side of through neck, no strap buttons. Head stock is all natural. Pickguard is thin white plastic

The less old one, which I think is a 59 or 60 has serial number of 4 C, with the 183 below the 4 C. This one does not have metal circle, and is smooth at bottom, with standard strap buttons. Head stock is dark-natural-dark. Pickguard is thick white plastic

Both have tin type truss cover.

Do the serial numbers mean any thing on these early guitars or was there not a system yet?

[doctorwho]

According to the info here:

http://www.provide.net/~cfh/rick.html#rickser

Solidbody Serial Numbers, 1954 to September 1959.

Number example: #(#)C####
Number is stamped on the jackplate or bridge.
Numeral(s) before letter designate model: 4=400 or 425, 6=600, 65=650, 8=800.
Letter (represented by "C" in above example) is type of instrument: C=combo (guitar), B=bass, M=mandolin, V=3/4 size.
First numeral after letter is year.
Last 3 numerals are number series.
Each model has its own series.
Example: 65C7123 = 1957 Combo 650, 4C6123 = 1956 Combo 400.
Exceptions:
Model 450 have 4C####A configuration ...

(assuming that it is correct), then 4C902 would be a 1959, and the 4C183 would be a 1961.

The date codes on the pots could help affirm these dates, so long as they are original to the guitar.

[tblair]

4C183 likely comes from the gaggle of 400-series guitars that lost their dating digits (1959-60). Apparently, they didn't know what to do when they reached 4C999.

By 1961, Rick was into their AA### style serial numbers- so it probably isn't that from that year.

[doctorwho]

Thanks for that clarification, Tony.