Sound for I wanna hold your hand ?

[Medicus1963]

Thank you all for your help,
I will try all the things you told me. Yes I use flatwounds but thomastik infield 13s.

Peter

[Hotzenplotz]

Thank you all for your help,
I will try all the things you told me. Yes I use flatwounds but thomastik infield 13s.

Peter

These are quite right for that sound, IMHO.

[ShakyDave]

Definitely flatwounds.

[Melma]

I'm having a brainfart - I thought he used the Gibson acoustic on that song. I'm getting it mixed up with another song, right?

[Medicus1963]

Hi,
I think it was the 325, because in the Ed sullivan show he has the same sound like in the record.
By the way i think i have nailed it now:
neck Pickup, tone rolled off completely
Vox Brilliant channel, Treble and bass all rolled down, High cut off all the way down.
A lot of compression from my jangle Box.

That is it !!

Thank you all !!

[Hotzenplotz]

@ Peter: One thing You forgot. The alder body and the very low output PUs are an indispensable condiment for that sound, IMHO!
Only then You get this hollow, barking sound.



Enjoy!

[Medicus1963]

Hi Sascha,
Yes you´re right. I will listen to both performances at Ed sullivan, because the first concert is with the 58 325 and the second one with the 64 325 with maple body.
Greetings

peter

[Hotzenplotz]

John Lennon mentioned in an interview that his first 325 was "the one". (Of course it was part of the early story, too.)
He meant that his Miami felt and sounded different. He never was able to acclimate with it so much. So maybe it was a bad idea to give him a new, maple one...

Whenever I will get a 325 it has to be with an alder body. Love that sound!

[wolfgang]

hello Peter,
this typical hollow sound of the Hamburg 325 (or a 325C58) does not work so well with the newer Miami 325, because their pickups had a higher impedance (about 2.5 Henries, like all other Rickenbackers of the time). With the newer pickups the sound is too muddy when you turn the treble pot fully down.
So the Ed Sullivan shows No. 1 and No. 3 were the last shows we could hear the original "I want to hold your hand"-sound, because Lennon used the old 358 for the last time.

Wolfgang
p.s. But the 2.5H-Pickups are not to blame, they give us the real Jangle, especially on 12-string guitars

[electrofaro]

about 2.5 Henries

Isn't one Henry enough?

[iiipopes]

about 2.5 Henries

Isn't one Henry enough?

No. You need at least eight.

But this brings up a good point: since most of us mere mortals only have access to, at best, a good multimeter, dc resistance figures tend to get thrown about. But a better measure of the tone of the pickup is its inductance, which is determined not only by the amount of wire on a coil, but its geometry and magnet structure as well.

[wolfgang]

so you say "2.5 Henry"?

There are some combind R-C-L meters in the 50$ range on the market. But it is not too easy to measure the right inductance value as long as the pickups aren't desoldered from the guitar circuity.

The inductance of the 7.5kOhm toasters is about 2.2 to 2.5 Henry. With my old "coiled cord" guitar cable ( about 1200 µµF capacitance) I get the right
electric Rickenbacker jangle (volume pot and treble pot fully on, bridge pickup only).

The pickups of the Hamburg 325 (and 325C58) have a much lower impedance, a resistance of about 3.5kOhm and an estimated inductivity as low as 0.6 Henry. This is why the 0.047 µF tone capacitor gives us the typical I want to hold your hand -sound with the treble pot turned comletely down (via the Vox amp).

Wolfgang

[Medicus1963]

Hi Wolfgang,
I use one guitar with and one without Glen´s loom which is without the Cap. And Glen´s loom gets you an much better "mudded" sound for this song !

Greetings

Peter

[wolfgang]

hello Peter,
of course I havn't seen a schematic diagram of Glen's loom .
But, as far as I know, both tone controls work with tone caps in a normal manner ( I don't mean the Rickenbacker "treble pickup bass-cut capacitor" of the basses and guitars).

With Glen's loom You can set the bridge pu volume independently from the toggle switch setting with the Bridge pu volume pot. With the toggle switch you can choose between neck pu only, middle pu only
or both off. This special toggle switch is wired to the second volume pot to mix the actual toggle switch setting with the bridge pu.

But to either volume pot there is a tone pot. If I'm not mistaken... This is what I know about Glen's (brilliant) loom.

The later (Miami) 3pu Rickenbacker circuity is not so versatile. In fact you can get only one good sound out of it:
Bridge pu on, treble pot fully clockwise. This jangles, even with a 325 3/4. To me, it wasn't the best idea to hard-wire the middle pu and neck pu in parallel.

Wolfgang

[Medicus1963]

Hi Wolfgang,

Yes this was not a very good idea. Best thing you can do with the five control layout is to connect the mix-knob directly with the middle pickup to blend it in and out individually.
Glen´s loom gives me all possible combinations in superb tone quality. Please forgive me that i will not publish Glen´s layout here, because it is copyright!
But he uses the old way of wiring with the correct poti values and characreristics as they were in the late 50´s and probably in Johns 58 Capri.

Grüße

Peter