Cave Passive Pedal "RFF Tour" begins!

[jps]

I am really impressed with what one can do with (I assume) diodes, caps and resistors. Depending on the input impedance of the load seen by the output of the B-Drive it does boost the signal quite considerably.I find the LVL control act as a bit of a tone control along with it's primary function; fully CW the tone is rolled of some making for a darker, meatier tone, while fully CCW the tone brightens, not quite to the bypassed tone but fairly close, but with it come a lot more volume, so I have to juggle with the volume control on the preamp I am running into to try and match levels to get a real idea of the differences in tonality.

When I plug into my Markbass Minimark amp (500KΩ input impedance) with the LVL control turned down (CW) the is some loss to the volume, but when I turn the LVL up to about Noon that seems to be unity gain, then it boosts up through the CCW position, gaining around 6-7dB, or so (this is purely from empirical listening to guess at the increase in dB). When I plug into one of my other amps, Walter Woods Electracoutic Super, Aguilar Tone Hammer 500, 1962 Fender Concert Amp (about 1MΩ input impedance) or my Raven Labs PHA-1 headphone amp/preamp (3.9MΩ input impedance) I get a significant increase in volume even with the LVL fully CW and it goes up a LOT from there through to fully CCW. That is simply astounding for a passive device.

The DRV does as advertised, creating a nice tube-like overdrive to the sound as the DRV is turned up CCW, sometimes almost too much. I do find that the frequency extremes get lopped off a bit, but I think that is appropriate for an overdriven sound as more bottom end would just muddy things up too much.

Basses used for this evaluation were: March '73 4001, Dec '11 4004 Laredo, April '11 Martin Keith Elfin 5 (passive Citron electronics), '05 Rick Turner RB4FL.

I think the ball indicator for active is very cool, nice creative thinking on Cave's part. I figured out that Cave is really an acronym for:

Creative And Visionary Electronics (or Effects)!

[johnallg]

Sounds like the B-Drive likes solid state amps over tube amps.

[jps]

The amount of overdrive sounds about the same, it is just the gain that is quite different. The Fender is all tube and the other amps are all solidstate and they react about the same, it is just the Minimark with its much lower input impedance that seems to be making a difference (in gain structure only), so I chalk it up to the load on the output of the B-Drive. With varying input loads it seems to react pretty similarly given the differences in the basses I used. One curious thing was when I was playing the Laredo a couple times and was switching between the pickups the output was a bit lower with just the neck HB-1 compared to the other settings, not by much, maybe around 4dB or so, but enough to notice compared to the bypass setting on the pedal.

I did some comparison tests with the B-Drive and my Bass Big Muff π tonight, both are good in their own way but I think I am favoring the B-Drive as it is a bit more organic sounding whereas sometimes I find the distortion of the BBMπ to seem disconnected from the dry bass signal.

My only real wish on the B-Drive is for a final output LVL control to balance the bypassed/ effected signal; for recording this is not an issue but in a live setting the boost from the pedal when engaged can be very overwhelming, great for that huge bass solo but not so great, otherwise.

[weemac]

The level control on the grunt pedal is a final level control. Jeff are you suggesting it does not go low enough for your applications?

Eden.

[jps]

Yes, in most cases, the effected level is higher, sometimes considerably so, with the LVL control all the way down (CW). I also find, in all cases, that the LVL control acts as a tone roll off matching the action of the volume, as the LVL is turned up (CCW) more treble frequencies are allowed to pass until at fully CCW most of the bass' treble response is restored.

[johnallg]

Yes, in most cases, the effected level is higher, sometimes considerably so, with the LVL control all the way down (CW). I also find, in all cases, that the LVL control acts as a tone roll off matching the action of the volume, as the LVL is turned up (CCW) more treble frequencies are allowed to pass until at fully CCW most of the bass' treble response is restored.

I noticed that about the LVL control also.

[jps]

The pedal sounds pretty nice with my 330. Perfect amount of grit for grindy chordal workout.

Am I allowed to use this with guitar?

[cassius987]

Yes, in most cases, the effected level is higher, sometimes considerably so, with the LVL control all the way down (CW). I also find, in all cases, that the LVL control acts as a tone roll off matching the action of the volume, as the LVL is turned up (CCW) more treble frequencies are allowed to pass until at fully CCW most of the bass' treble response is restored.

I am really confused as this is not how I experienced the pedal in my hands. I found the level control to be pretty effective and equal to the clean level when fully up. Whereas Jeff is seeing a lot more gain with it than I did and can't get the level control to work. This pedal seems to be different for each person! In my hands it just seemed to make things sound a little dirtier and was really as simple as that. Maybe I wasn't doing something right... Seems like the signal path really affects this one?

[cjj]

Yes, in most cases, the effected level is higher, sometimes considerably so, with the LVL control all the way down (CW). I also find, in all cases, that the LVL control acts as a tone roll off matching the action of the volume, as the LVL is turned up (CCW) more treble frequencies are allowed to pass until at fully CCW most of the bass' treble response is restored.

I am really confused as this is not how I experienced the pedal in my hands. I found the level control to be pretty effective and equal to the clean level when fully up. Whereas Jeff is seeing a lot more gain with it than I did and can't get the level control to work. This pedal seems to be different for each person! In my hands it just seemed to make things sound a little dirtier and was really as simple as that. Maybe I wasn't doing something right... Seems like the signal path really affects this one?

Yeah, me too. I had pretty much the same experience as Joshua. Kind of makes me want to get it back to try again...

[jps]

...Whereas Jeff is seeing a lot more gain with it than I did and can't get the level control to work..

The LVL control works just fine; it can produce up to around 8-10dB in "gain" even with the DRV control fully off (CW). It also act as a tone roll off when going from full LVL (CCW-brightest tone) to darkest tone when fully CW, so you get three controls for the price and space of two!

With the DRV (is this shorthand for drivel? ) fully up (CCW) I can get a pretty gnarly overdrive from all my basses.

[jps]

This pedal seems to be different for each person! In my hands it just seemed to make things sound a little dirtier and was really as simple as that. Maybe I wasn't doing something right...

Yeah, me too. I had pretty much the same experience as Joshua. Kind of makes me want to get it back to try again...

I'm special!

[woodyng]

That is interesting,of course ya'll heard the results i got,which were fairly subtle even with all the controls wide open. Even when i used it at practice at a much louder amp setting,it basically just gave me a bit of grit,which sounded like one of the lower settings on the VT pedal,nowhere near as grungy/screamy as that pedal can conjure up...

[jps]

I started to set up for some recording to GarageBand, trying the pedal straight into the computer. In this mode I get a really huge drop in level and not as much overdrive; I assume the input impedance of the Mac's audio in is pretty low. Anybody know what it is? I put the PHA-1 in line and now I get the results I have been getting so far, boosted signal and nice tube amp-like overdrive.

After dinner the recording will commence.

[jps]

Okay, I found the specs for the audio in on the Mac, it is 20KΩ, typical consumer line in impedance, so the B-Drive does not like that.

[cassius987]

I started to set up for some recording to GarageBand, trying the pedal straight into the computer. In this mode I get a really huge drop in level and not as much overdrive; I assume the input impedance of the Mac's audio in is pretty low. Anybody know what it is? I put the PHA-1 in line and now I get the results I have been getting so far, boosted signal and nice tube amp-like overdrive.

After dinner the recording will commence.

Yes, you absolutely need a buffer between the guitar and the Mac in my experience. Unfortunately when I had this pedal my home recording rig was really goofed up and I didn't have a good way to buffer things going into my laptop so my clips sound like nothing much is happening but some dirt. That could have been part of the problem.

EDIT: Nice find Jeff...

Okay, I found the specs for the audio in on the Mac, it is 20KΩ, typical consumer line in impedance, so the B-Drive does not like that.

Thanks for posting. Even "worse" than I thought! (Although no one should be expecting a passive bass to sound good plugged straight into most laptops.)

This is where I will plug the Apogee Jam: it absolutely saved me from recording hell when my wife bought it for me for Christmas. So affordable and absolutely the best buffer into GarageBand I have owned so far (by a huge margin too). Nearly as good as the more expensive Apogee products; sound quality is top notch. I know I've posted this track already but the bass in it was recorded with the Jam as the only other part of the signal path: https://soundcloud.com/cassius987/sketc ... elo-chords