Question about Drop D tuning

[cjj]

Wow, a pitch shifter sounds fantastic as long as it doesn't have to much of a mechanical flavor to it. ie: some lower end harmonizers.

A lot of this sort of thing can be done with Digital Signal Processing. Once a signal is digitized, it's a fairly simple matter to shift the pitch by a set amount.

I've actually got a unit that will do that, a Lexicon MX-200. It allows you to shift the pitch up or down by up to 24 semitones (2 octaves). I haven't really used it a lot though since I mainly got it for reverbs. I did set up a few programs, one to combine the original with an octave up (to simulate an 8 string bass), sounds pretty good. I did another one to do an octave up, an octave down, all mixed with the original (for, uh, 12 string with sub-bass?). It sounds pretty massive.
It would probably work for drop tunings too, but like I said, I haven't really messed with it too much.

I think whether or not it colors the tone will depend a lot on the quality of the A/D converters, etc. Theoretically, it should be possible to make it almost perfect. Of course, there's always the old debate of digital vs. analog and which sounds better...

[JackTheRipper]

Jack,

Does the electronic drop tune device color tone? For all the different keys we do, this would seem like a solution to maintaining two basses on stage. We do few songs in low C but I refuse to "condemn" a bass to drop C tuning.

I'll do a bit of research on them but real quick, how do they work? Do you program in what note's are to be altered and the device just switches it to the desired dropped note??

Sepp

I have only used the Electro-Harmonix microPOG and HOG (octave generators) and they do not color tone. I've never used the pitch shifters like the Whammy so I can't comment on that. There may be a YouTube demo video that may answer that question though. Worth a look at least...

I looked at the Whammy manual for a minute and setting the device seems easy. Just flip a switch to tell it how man semi-tones you want to alter the pitch and that's it. It will alter every note you play.

--jack

[JackTheRipper]

Wow, a pitch shifter sounds fantastic as long as it doesn't have to much of a mechanical flavor to it. ie: some lower end harmonizers.
I emailed Digitech and asked about using it for a full step drop with a bass and their response was that it would work fine for bass.

Gonna do some research and check reviews cause this could be a great fix!
Ar least it might eliminate nut shaving and re-setup

I'd wager that you can find a review on YouTube that would provide the answers you're after. I looked at a few (for guitar) and it seemed fine to me.

--jack

[JackTheRipper]

I've never tried these, but it looks interesting.

http://www.juststrings.com/ddtdrstrings ... uitar.html

I use these string on my Charvel 2B bass for drop C tuning and they work great. The tension on the "E" string is just a wee bit too low for me, but it's really not a big deal.

--jack

[jps]

I have only used the Electro-Harmonix microPOG and HOG (octave generators) and they do not color tone.

--jack

I have a microPOG; as cool as it is and what it does, I find both the octave down and octave up sounds to be kind of synthy and there is a slight delay compared to the straight bass (or guitar) sound, more so with the upper octave which compounds the artificiality of the final tone. With moderate settings the pedal does sound good in context with other instruments playing along, by itself not as well. I may check out the MXR Bass Octave Deluxe since it sounded great when I saw Return To Forever last Fall as Stanley used his a lot with his tenor bass for "his normal range" sounds. I did try one briefly at my local Sam Ash a while ago but the (extremely bright) white indicator light blinded me the first time I engaged the pedal which hampered my objective opinion of it.

[aceonbass]

I'd go with one of the Hipshot Drop-D tuners on your E string. I think the one that replaces the Kluson tuner on your bass is a model BT5. They have to be special ordered though, and be sure to request the shorter tuner key. You'll need to use a heavier gauge E string too. When I had a 3000 bass converted to 5-string several years ago, I used a stock set of Rickenbacker 4003S5 strings with a .115 B, and it sounded great. Using that same gauge with drop D tuner would sound even better due to the slightly higher tension. I still have several new .115 B strings left if your interested. Dropping the whole bass down a step will require heavier gauge strings all around with a corresponding change to all four nut slots, which may have to be replaced if you ever go back to standard gauge strings.

[Kopfjaeger]

OK, a little help, please!

I've just been informed that our singer & guitards would like to play a few songs a half step down. While I kinda don't have a problem trying to down tune all four strings between songs, I kinda am a bit OCD about having correct pitch. Yes, I'm one of those guys that checks his pitch in between ever song or at minimum, every other song!!

I would like to to try a "drop tune" pedal, but I have no idea where to start looking and what are respected products. I'm looking for a stomp box, not a rack mount. I kinda like the look of the DigiTech Whammy DT pedal but it has many features I'll probably never use. I have a drop D bass so I doubt I'd need to go more than a full step up or down. The Electro Harmonix POG does not look like it will suit me since I don't need to add an octave up and or down to my sound. All I'm looking for is a very reliable drop tune device that is easy to set and visually and positively set the amount of drop I need. One of my fears is something with knobs that can move during transport and change my setting, causing me to have to screw with it at a pretty stressful time. I worry about latency as well as a clean un colored tone.

Any suggestions??

Sepp

[aceonbass]

Sepp....If you have a drop D bass, then why not just use that for the few songs your band does half a step down? I'm guessing by half a step, they're taking songs from E to Eb, or else this wouldn't be an issue. I have Hipshot extenders replacing all of the E tuners on my basses for this reason. Are your guitarists tuning half a step flat too?

[Kopfjaeger]

Dane,

We do some QotSA in C but yes, were talking about mostly Eb for some Alice n Chains. We're playing it in E and the singer is struggling a bit. While yes, i could use my drop D tuned bass to cover it or my Modulus 5 string but muscle memory has been established with these songs and to re learn the fingering is not sitting well with me. It's either drop tune a bass or use electronics or get a singer that can sing Lane Staley in E! Or a bass player that is more open to change!

Sepp

[jps]

It's either drop tune a bass or use electronics or get a singer that can sing Lane Staley in E! Or a bass player that is more open to change!

Sepp

I opt for a new singer!

[LenMinNJ]

I would like to to try a "drop tune" pedal, but I have no idea where to start looking and what are respected products.
Any suggestions??

I tried one of the discontinued Morpheus Drop Tune pedals today. It works pretty fine for guitar, and on a bass too as long as you don't go too low on your neck. Go too low and it can't track.

For what it does, it's amazing. Really.

It allows you to step on a switch and tune down one step at a time. It's hard to believe that it works, but it does. It changes your tone so you'd have to decide if it's acceptable for you.

I found one at the Guitar Center in Totowa NJ. There's one at the St. Louis MO store too, at a lower price.

See a demo on YouTube.

The Whammy DT may do a better job. See a video of it being used with a Steinberger XL2 bass here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCpeCB531II . Start at around 7:59.

[Kopfjaeger]

Len,

About the Morpheus pedal, since I had been looking at this device, how low on the neck before the tracking issues begin? Off the top of me head I think most of the frets I use for the songs I'd need it for are within fret one through 5 on the E and A string.

Sepp

[teeder]

Dane,

We do some QotSA in C but yes, were talking about mostly Eb for some Alice n Chains. We're playing it in E and the singer is struggling a bit. While yes, i could use my drop D tuned bass to cover it or my Modulus 5 string but muscle memory has been established with these songs and to re learn the fingering is not sitting well with me. It's either drop tune a bass or use electronics or get a singer that can sing Lane Staley in E! Or a bass player that is more open to change!

Sepp

How about playing everything tuned to Eb and then use the drop tuner? That's what we do playing the same music. All 3 of us that sing are 46-47 and are struggling a bit!

[Kopfjaeger]

The problem is, I have too many Rickenbackers. There, I've said it!!! To put drop tuners on the basses I use would mean I'd need quite a few and the closed back Schaller tuners on my 4004 and 4002's would still need a way to reach Eb, Ab, Db, Gb.

I do have a way to solve this issue and that's to either use my drop D 4003 and re configure how I play those songs but that would mean re learning a handful of songs. I'd rather not relearn how I play a song. I realize it's only a one fret move down but I'm stressing 0ut a bit over having to change the way i play the songs. Stupid? Maybe but I'm being honest. Or use My 5 string Modulus, but I'm not a huge fan of that bass. While it's nice, it's just not my first, or eighth, choice to use.

I think the electronic drop tune box may be the best choice for me if it will accomplish what I hope it will. In my mind, it would be the best case scenario for my dilemma.

Sepp

[jps]

Use the 5 string or tune a bass in E♭|A♭|D♭|G♭ and for whatever few songs at concert pitch use a capo.