1968 4001

[RickyBubba]

This bass needs a good appraisal, and an insurance policy...really.

[teeder]

Me too.

Very nice, Steve! I love it!

[wints]

I'm not too worried about having period correct horseshoes. In fact given the nature of them losing their magnetic charge in some cases, I'm more inclined to go for a new set!

Makes sense to me Steve.

I'll beg to differ here. A correctly, fully charged pair of vintage horseshoes produces that classic 4001 tone, as well as keeping an extremely rare instrument completely period correct and original. It's a win-win from every angle, from the sound to the value. When I restored a '67 RM a few years ago, I managed to buy a lap steel that was exactly from where that batch of RM1999 was produced, as I wanted it as correct as possible.

In this instance, where the instrument and finish are completely original except for the horseshoes, I can't see the logic in putting a fake pair in...

[Kopfjaeger]

I'm not too worried about having period correct horseshoes. In fact given the nature of them losing their magnetic charge in some cases, I'm more inclined to go for a new set!

Makes sense to me Steve.

I'll beg to differ here. A correctly, fully charged pair of vintage horseshoes produces that classic 4001 tone, as well as keeping an extremely rare instrument completely period correct and original. It's a win-win from every angle, from the sound to the value. When I restored a '67 RM a few years ago, I managed to buy a lap steel that was exactly from where that batch of RM1999 was produced, as I wanted it as correct as possible.

In this instance, where the instrument and finish are completely original except for the horseshoes, I can't see the logic in putting a fake pair in...

Andy, thanks for saying what I had been thinking! That's the exact route I'd go with this as well. I like Jason, i really do but this instrument is screaming for a pair of original shoes and that's an easy fix!! Not at all like attempting to find a set of late 68 wide opening shoes.

Sepp

[Ontario_RIC_fan]

HA! lol


Congrats... There are some cool vintage RICS in Canada.

[pag]

I have a 60s Rickenbacker Electro lap steel that has the wide gap shoes.
Theres a few of these around so you might try that route for your 68 bass.

[pag]

I might trade for a complete original aluminium bridge/tail if theres one out there in good shape.

[Kopfjaeger]

I have a 60s Rickenbacker Electro lap steel that has the wide gap shoes.
Theres a few of these around so you might try that route for your 68 bass.

Pete,

The open end of the horseshoe "U" needs to be spread further for the new later 68 taller slotted pole bobbin. This bobbin is .5 of an inch tall as compared to the much lower raised lip bobbin used from 1964 into early 1968. The gap between the two shoes is much less a factor. Since the OP's bass has the lower early bobbin, getting a set of donor shoes will mean the bass will be 100% correct. it will never be that with a set of shoes from Lollar. For what the OP will pay for a set of magnets from Jason will be equal to or slightly more than he'd pay for a donor lap steel. Worrying about the shoes discharging is silly since Lollar's shoes may be more prone to discharge due the material he's using. RIC stopped making the horsie since they could no longer get the proper material to make the horsie reliable.

Another thing about Jason's shoes the OP needs to be aware of. Jason heat treats the shoes after forming and that some times distorts the shoe. One shoe may not match the other. Jason tries to match pairs as close as possible but one may be higher or lower than the other. Maybe not so much with a vintage set of shoes.

Once again, I'm not bashing Jason, he's a great guy and we have had many long conversations about the RIC horsie. While many of us don't collect ot view our instruments as collector pieces, the fact of the matter is a 1968 4001 is a collectors wet dream! Putting a Lollar on this instrument is NOT like painting a mustache on the Mona Lisa but it certainly is like touching up the faded areas with finger paint. Why would you do it??

Sepp

[jps]

Another thing about Jason's shoes the OP needs to be aware of. Jason heat treats the shoes after forming and that some times distorts the shoe. One shoe may not match the other. Jason tries to match pairs as close as possible but one may be higher or lower than the other. Not so with a vintage set of shoes.

Sepp

[henry5]

I can see I'm going to get in a lot of trouble with my '68, which will hardly have original anything bar woodwork and will have a couple of non-Ric parts! Still, some of you will have already seen it and it's pretty much bringing it back from the dead to be a playable bass on a workable budget. Apologies in advance.

If Steve can get original shoes for similar money and they work better, then obviously that's a better choice. That's really interesting about the original shoes vs Jason's, Sepp. Kind of puts me off the Lollar a bit; that's a lot of money for something that may be inferior. I have no experience of original 'shoes whatsoever; never played anything prior to '69 and my fave Rics so far are all '72s. You also have to remember that I'm speaking foremost as a player, not a collector, from the North West of the UK, where an old Ric (hell, even a new one) is like the Loch Ness Monster. I've had people coming to gigs ten or fifteen years later and saying "oh I knew it was you playing because of the Rics on stage". I've been a Ric fanatic for over 30 years and I've never even seen anything, bass or part, from a Ric prior to '69 in the flesh. They hardly exist here (certainly round my neck of the woods), except in the hands of pretty serious collectors or the very lucky few.

[Kopfjaeger]

Jeff,

Thanks for posting what most certainly is two sets of Monday morning paired shoes!

Shaun, you are resurrecting a vintage instrument from the dead. No comparison to what we have hear. If the finish is original and in really nice shape and there is nto structural damage to the instrument and 95'5 of the parts are there, why not go the distance and put in the missing and easy 5%? OK, it's not my instrument but I'm nto understanding the logic of going the Lollar route when original shoes would make this instrument 100% correct.

Before I found the proper wide opening shoes and pup for my 68, I contemplated a Lollar horsie, since the odds of finding the very rare and elusive shoes was going to be next to impossible. I also contacted several magnet companies in order to see if I could have a pair of shoes made to my specs. I did the near impossible, I found the correct horsie and I paid through the nose for it. Now another option would have been to put a raised lip bobbin in her and lap steel shoes. that would have been the easy route since I have a bobbin as well as a set of shoes but it would not have been correct for a late year instrument. I also could have put a magnet under the spare slotted pole pup i have but I felt this bass needed a horsie.

OK, rant over. I've said my peace and then some. I'm done.

Sepp

[henry5]

Thanks for the reassurance Sepp. I'll keep my flak jacket on for now though, just in case.

[henry5]

Another thing about Jason's shoes the OP needs to be aware of. Jason heat treats the shoes after forming and that some times distorts the shoe. One shoe may not match the other. Jason tries to match pairs as close as possible but one may be higher or lower than the other. Not so with a vintage set of shoes.

Sepp

Hey, you know what? After everything I said I think I may have had a set of those shoes like in the 2nd picture! Got them with my 2nd CS: they obviously weren't from a reissue and weighed a ton, but I wouldn't have known if they were originals (or even real) or not. Maybe they weren't and were fakes; they weren't magnetic so far as I could tell. Couldn't get any clearance with them so sold them to a UK Ric enthusiast.

[wints]

Sean,

I wouldn't worry about your '68 offending here...As Sepp mentions, it's a completely different animal. I have a line on a '68 and the only thing original about it is the body and the tuners...and it doesn't even have all it's original body! Active p/ups, badass, etc, but it sounds and plays fantastic, easily as good as the best 4001 I've ever laid my hands on.

I'm not sure I'd change a thing on it...

[henry5]

Sean,

I wouldn't worry about your '68 offending here...As Sepp mentions, it's a completely different animal. I have a line on a '68 and the only thing original about it is the body and the tuners...and it doesn't even have all it's original body! Active p/ups, badass, etc, but it sounds and plays fantastic, easily as good as the best 4001 I've ever laid my hands on.

I'm not sure I'd change a thing on it...

Now that I have to see!

I was thinking about this the other day; I must admit I'm always a bit uncomfortable about changing stuff on my Rics; I feel guilty about it. But then I look at many of my favourite Ric players; Squire, Lemmy, McCartney, Camp, DeMaio, Lee.....all modded basses in some way or other.