Differences between 4001 and 4003?

phlemmy · Post by **phlemmy** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 2:24 pm

looking at the 4001s and 4003s on gBase, how much difference is there in them? mainly the mid 80s 4003 to the latter day 4001s.

and what year did they change from the 4001 to the 4003?

thanks.

rickfan60 · Post by **rickfan60** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 2:46 pm

The biggest general difference is the structure of the neck. The 4001 has a 3 piece neck slab (plus headstock wings) where the 4003 has essentially a one piece neck. There are two pieces in a 4003 neck that are not visible on the finished bass. There were several versions of the 4003, so it is not really just one model. The early 4003s were more like the 4001 than the later ones. In September of '84 the 4003 received the modern truss system. Before that, they had the same system found in the 4001. Over the years the 4003 got progressivly hotter pickups. Subtle refinements occured including a return to a more 60's style body shape with more slender horns and a larger headstock. There were also several versions of the 4001 so it is difficult to compare the two models head to head. The 4001/3 has been in continous production for nearly 44 years. Suffice it to say that the breed improved steadily over the years.

green_us90 · Post by **green_us90** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 3:01 pm

4003- introduced ~1978
4001- discontinued ~1986.

About an 8 year overlap. I think.

rickfan60 · Post by **rickfan60** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 3:11 pm

JH says despite the conflicting dates, there was no production overlap of the models. The 4001 stopped sometime between '80 and '81 and the 4003 started immediately thereafter. There were 4001 production stragglers, reworks and lingering inventory that lasted well into the 80's. It was explained to me that the post cutover 4001 serial numbers are accounted for that way.

walrus · Post by **walrus** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 4:16 pm

I don't know the exact date of this catalog from RICs website, but it looks like there was an overlap. It could be that the overlap was to clear out old stock. The main difference was the truss rod design. The first 4003s also had a two piece pickguard and the truss rod adjustment was done at the body end, not the headstock. See the link for more details.
Late 70s Catalog

rickfan60 · Post by **rickfan60** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 5:17 pm

There was merely overlap in sales. Back then, Rickenbacker maintained larger inventories that they do today. They were shipping 4001 for a few years after the last one was made.

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 6:45 pm

I've seen several 1980 4003's, have never seen any earlier, and have seen 4001's up until 1986 although not common. I also remember JH's statement that they were not made concurrently, the 4001's were just left over stock. My 81 4003 is exactly like a 4001 except for the reversed truss rods. Let me re-phrase that because Ted has some points there, it looks and plays exactly like a 4001, but it doesn't have the skunk stripe in it and there may be other subtle differences that I'm not aware of, but it feels, looks and plays just like a 4001 except for the two piece pickguard. The neck is also two piece.

rickfan60 · Post by **rickfan60** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 7:07 pm

One other difference is that the 4003 has a tapered neck slab where the 4001 has a rectangular one. The body portion of the neck slab on a 4001 is the same width from the end button to the cutaways. The slab of a 4003 is wider at the end button than it is at the cutaways. This is the reason why the 4003 has broader headstock wings than the 70's era 4001. The slab tapers all the way to the tip of the headstock. Wider wings are needed to make up the difference. I don't know if this was done to simplify manufacturing or to enable RIC to bring back 60's width walnut wings or both. Of course, there could be an entirely different reason for it.

This is just a guess on my part.

iamthebassman · Post by **iamthebassman** » Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:24 am

I have an '80 4003 and an '84 4001S.

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Tue Feb 22, 2005 6:20 am

Ted, what are end buttons and neck slabs? I look at my 81 4003 and the horns are the same width as my 4001's so is the headstock. I can't see any differences although I haven't really looked extensively. I'm not following your idea.

rickfan60 · Post by **rickfan60** » Tue Feb 22, 2005 6:55 am

Not the horns, sorry. Maybe I did not explain that very well. The body of 4001/3 is made up up 3 sections, the 2 body wings and the neck thru-neck (center part of the body). The center part of a 4001 is the same width from one end of the body to the other. When the bass is viewed from the front. The center part of a 4003 tapers slightly from the bottom strap button to the cutaways. This can only be easily seen through transparent finishes.

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Tue Feb 22, 2005 10:37 am

Ted, my 96 jetglo (can see it) measures 2 3/8" at the horn end and measures 2 5/8" at the button end. My 79 4001 and my 81 4003 are identical, they both measure 2 1/4" at both ends. My 81 is really a 4001 with reversed truss rods, the necks, headstocks and tuners are identical also.
Interestingly enough my 78 4001 measures 2 1/4" at the horn end and 2 3/8" at the button end.

rickfan60 · Post by **rickfan60** » Tue Feb 22, 2005 10:49 am

I have a '75 4001 that is the same at both ends and my '80 4001 appears to be though I have never measured it. I will measure up a few of mine tonight.