Confused about sound please help

jblakey · Post by **jblakey** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 1:35 pm

I remember an article in Guitar Player magazine back in the eighties in which the author was allowed onstage by some famous rocker/guitar player before the crowd was able to come into the arena. The artist let the author of the article play his guitar/rig. But he was surprised that he still sounded very much like he always did and not like the stellar rocker. The point was that much of one's tone is so connected to personal playing style.
On the sub thread here.. I think that the best players are the ones who know that there is always someone better out there.

grayk · Post by **grayk** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 2:49 pm

Hi Brett, Welcome to the forum. I lifted this short piece from your post.

"I went to a local music store and tried a new 4003 through an ashdown amp at moderarte volume. I was amazed at how good it sounded".

Well Ashdown amps are great and they seem to compliment the 4003 very nicely so I am not surprised it sounded well. Anyway in my opinion you would have more chance of getting a Geddy Lee sound with a 4001. It isnt impossible on a 4003 though. I agree with Jay, a lot of the sound is with the person and not always the gear. I do think you can get a near Geddy sound if you back off the neck pickup, use a little distortion, back off the bass end a bit on the amp, and play hard.

atomic_punk · Post by **atomic_punk** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:33 pm

I've always heard Eddie Van Halen say that people who play his guitar thru his rig don't sound like him, they still sound like THEM. Meaning, you might get the tone, but it will always be you. Find something that you like, play it hard, and maybe someday people will be trying to figure out YOUR tone.

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 6:06 pm

Eddie got his tone with cheap guitars and cheap amps ...

baltimucho · Post by **baltimucho** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 6:33 pm

Try buying a Marshall plexi and a Wayne Charvel now! =)

Anywhooo... I was at NAMM a few years ago while EVH has giving a demo of the Peavy 5150 II head. He was just tearin' it up and taking questions inbetween noodling when someone asked, "What kind of effect are you using to get that sound?" HA! He held up the cable and said, "It's just ME, man."

Any, anywhooo... I'm a sucky bass player but I can get the PERFECT Geddy tone by plugging my '84 4003S into my '69 SVT head and Ampeg 4x10 Classic cabinet (using a stereo-Y cable to put the treble pickup in the "high" input and the bass pickup in the "normal" input"), bass pickup at 30% and treble pickup at 100% and plucking with my fingers and letting my fingernails scrape the strings. Now, if I could only PLAY...

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 7:50 pm

EVH also used variacs in the studio to raise the voltage about 10% on his Marshalls which is not a very good thing to do for any length of time. I thought he had a great sound.
Brett, where do you play in Connecticut? I'm from Worcester Ma. I think the last time I played Conn. was about 20 years ago, Hartford. I know why you said you were good, to let us know that you're not a beginner looking for a lot of tips on how to get that sound, you're a seasoned pro looking for lots of tips on how to get that sound, haha! I spend about half my time on URB and half on rics lately.
I also believe 90% is the way you play it although some Rics, strings and amps lend themselves toward getting certain sounds. I once got a very convincing Chris Squire sound with a P bass, Rotos, a Sunn SS lead head and an SVT cab. The sound was just there, especially the head, I just found myself naturally playing that style because of the natural propensity of the equipment to do that sound and I don't even use picks or very rarely do anyway.

ken_swearingen · Post by **ken_swearingen** » Mon Feb 28, 2005 9:03 pm

I agree with alot of what Jeff says although Ive never used distortion compressor yes ive been close to Getty 's sound well enough to cover there tunes ,hey but guess what only Getty can sound exactly like Getty,find your own tone if its close to Getty's so be it.maybe there will be people trying to sound like you someday.I happen to think getty is just a unique bass player who found a style and sound we all envy.

freewheelin · Post by **freewheelin** » Tue Mar 01, 2005 3:56 am

Don't you think that the sound is in YOU and not in the strings, an amp or an instrument, even if it sounds very good ?
You can only get the sound that you can hear, even if you are really good bassist it can't be so easy... Rickenbacker basses sound great, Fender basses too, and there are lots of good amps to get YOUR sound.
Happy to know that many of you can get the Geddy's sound, yes you must be really good. Do you use a pick with your left hand too ?
See you, good bassists not afraid to say so...

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Tue Mar 01, 2005 4:47 am

I use a pick on my teeth also ... and yes we are all really good here ... and we are all nice to each other here ... well for the most part anyway ...

freewheelin · Post by **freewheelin** » Tue Mar 01, 2005 5:01 am

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Tue Mar 01, 2005 6:15 am

I don't envy Geddy's sound at all, in fact if that was the only sound I could get out of a Ric I would have switched years ago. I think he's got a great sound for his music, like Squire's is great for his music. I go for a totally different sound and get it with Rics. I play blues, 50's rock, rock a billy, punk, jazz, surf, garage rock, etc. no progressive rock for this guy.

brett_bottomley · Post by **brett_bottomley** » Tue Mar 01, 2005 6:43 am

Hi everyone
Bob I play alot in the new haven area mostly jazz duos trios etc. on upright or jazz solo duo etc. on chapman stick. I'm also in a hard rock band called Standing Stone we play half originals and half covers (no Rush). I should have a web site up soon for my gigs recordings etc I'll let you know when I do if you want.

In regards to the sub plot of talent and sound etc. I think too many people think of music as a competition, I don't. I live in a world with Geddy and pat Metheny and van Halen and keith jarrett and many many more incredible players. I play because of how these and other players have moved me, have filled me with joy. I don't want to sound or play just like them, This would be insanity. I only want to be the best musician and person I can be.
I have my own voice and I love to use it through musical interplay, to me thats what its all about.
As for Geddy's tone I just hear it and want to add SOME of that to my voice. not just like him but as a tribute to him. The same way I pay tribute to Charlie Parker when I quote one of his licks.
I don't want to be a bass idol. I don't want young kids trying to emulate my sound. WHY? because then
there would be some smuck telling them to be themselves and get there own sound so that someday people would want to sound like them. See the paradox?

Brett Bottomley

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Tue Mar 01, 2005 7:00 am

I love the old Geddy sound a lot ... I went to a open blues jam recently ... and I usually get to do a solo ... I do different types of styles ... fingers, thumbs, picks, etc ... but last time I played my new 2020 with distortion on it ... I was whacking the low B string with a pick ... this was a tone not usually associated with blues ... but they loved it ... I believe that those of us who play in cover bands should be versatile and be able to play many styles and get different tones ... that's why I like a Ric bass and my bass pod ... I can get many different tones ...

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Tue Mar 01, 2005 5:55 pm

it is interesting ... Geddy not only got that sound with the 4001 he got an almost identical sound with the jazz bass ... listen to moving pictures and try to figure out which songs he used the ric and which he used the jazz bass ... they sound very similar ... but listen to the old recordings of "The Trees" he used the ric bass on the old recording but on the "Different Stages" and "Rush in Rio" he uses the jazz bass and there is a noticable difference ...

rpmartino · Post by **rpmartino** » Wed Mar 02, 2005 6:10 am

Good point about Geddy's sound on Moving Pictures... from interviews it would seem that Tom Sawyer features the Jazz and Red Barchetta the Rick, and it's hard to tell them apart. MP seems to incorporate a "dirtier", more overdriven bass sound which I don't care for as much as the Permanent Waves/Hemispheres/Signals sound.

Geddy's amp setup now is much different now then the one he used in the late 70s/early 80s, he's got a more direct setup using a combination of an Avalon preamp, Sansamp RBI and Palmer speaker simulator, which accounts for why is tone now is fairly different than it was back then.

I've got a 4001v63 myself and can get a decent Squier/Geddy sort of tone but I'm curious how much of the sound has to do with the preamp/effects and how much is due to the bass. I haven't played another bass through my own setup in a while, apart from a Chapman Stick (Hi Brett.

Rob
http://robmartino.com