Biased teachers!

clankchris · Post by **clankchris** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 10:11 pm

Hey everybody, I've been playing bass for a while now, but have only taken it a little more seriously in the past couple of years. I've been playing with people for the past three years, and think the guys I play with now have a lot of potential(I love everything we come up with), and we're really good friends.
I learned to play bass using my fingers only, but really found my voice using a pick not too long ago(used to scoff at pick players until I realized
they were my favorites!).
I want to become a better player than I am now(I'm not unhappy or anything, just want someone to push me a little!), so I decided I might want to try some lessons.
Well, herein lies my problem. I've called some places around here, and they seem to uh, not approve of pick players, or are not even bassplayers(I realize I can learn from a guitarist, but I would prefer a real bassist).
Do I keep searching for an open-minded individual, or just bite my tongue and learn under a "proper"(fingerstyle only) bassist?

sabbath_of_bass · Post by **sabbath_of_bass** » Tue Jul 12, 2005 10:49 pm

I dont know. I say wait for someone open minded about it. Cause personally I think you should try and play a little of it all. My bass teacher pretty much said I dont think youll ever be a pick player but it wouldnt hurt to learn so i want you to play with it some. I was like okay. So i can play some what with a pick. Who cares about proper. The important part is if it sounds good and you can play well. I dislike picks but sometimes you may need that sound so might as well learn it. It cant hurt.

edski · Post by **edski** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 12:22 am

Takes a while to find a good teacher, and IMO playing is the best lesson. Keep jamming, keep trying to learn things. There are lots of resources around now.

A good teacher is a very good thing for learning, but by no means is absolutely required in order to learn. I see you are in Orlando...Jeff Berlin has a school over here in Tampa; I know they occasionaly have workshops. There has got to be a decent supply of bass teachers in Mouse town...

Just might have to look harder.

Good luck...my suggestion would be to learn your scales and modes in as many ways possible. Learn to read some sort of notation more advanced than tab...lead sheets or traditional notation. Try to learn a little music theory and try to find it action.

Sure, a teacher can help guide you, but you can learn these things yourself. Actually, in the end, each of us has to learn these things ourselves anyway. A good teacher should be there to show the way and help with any confusion that arises...certainly the teacher can't play the instrument for you. And a teacher should NOT discriminate between pick and finger players, especially one who can do BOTH and chooses to play more with a pick. Again, who is actually playing the instrument, student or teacher?

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 2:23 am

Famous bass players who use a pick part or all of the time ...

Chris Squire, John Entwistle, Paul Mccartney, Roger Waters, Geezer Butler, Mel Schacher ...

the pick is a tool ... so are your fingers ... so is your thumb ... learn to use them all ...

admin · Post by **admin** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 2:30 am

Jeff: Then there was the biting lead guitar of Jimi Hendrix.

ken_j · Post by **ken_j** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 2:45 am

Tasty licks?

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 3:12 am

I think Hendrix used a pick most of the time when he wasn't using his teeth. They probably wouldn't have approved of playing with teeth either.

I use my fingers 99% of the time but will occasionally use a pick, it's nice to learn as many techniques as you can except for slapping of course which is an aberration of course, hahah! IMHO picking is a good technique to know but if you are a serious bassist I would concentrate on learning with your fingers first as I would say 95% of bassist's use fingers nowadays and it sounds better for most types of music although I'm sure there are a lot of people here who will disagree with that last statement, if you only use a pick you are limiting yourself severely in the music world, many people besides other bass players look down on picks. Fairly or unfairly to most musicians players who exclusively use a pick are widely seen as being sclock musicians who never learned the proper way to play a bass. It is a predjudice that is very ingrained in the music world. I think the only types of music it is widely accepted in is in 70's heavy metal or 70's prog rock.

charlyg · Post by **charlyg** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 3:54 am

I found a pick gets the beat right on in a fast tune! The pads of the fingers have more give and therefore you must be "on top" of the beat for it to strike precisely on the downbeat. So...mostly fingers unless I need to be "spot on"...

iamthebassman · Post by **iamthebassman** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 4:00 am

Here we go, yet again. At least once a week the pick vs. fingers BS starts up. Took till Wednesday this week. Don't you guys ever get tired of this ****?

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 5:29 am

I don't know about any other posters here but I wasn't bashing picks, I don't want to get in the middle of another stupid argument like that flat vs rounds thing, I use them occasionally also, just that the reality is that they are looked down on by most musicians and should be an adjunct to your style not the main style, and I think any young player should realize that before he commits himself to a style that will most likely hinder his later success especially if he is serious at all about playing as a pro someday. I'm not saying all pro players use their fingers but most do especially nowadays. Joe Osborn had a damn good career with a pick but that was 35-40 years ago. All those players Jeff mentioned before also started playing 40 years ago and are or would have been in their late 50's and 60's. Entwistle was more of a finger player, and almost all of those guys played both styles except Squire (unless he did too). Also if anyone here is ever considering going on to upright which are really fun to play and get you a lot of gigs, you cannot play them with a pick at all and it would be much harder to go from a pick to plucking than from fingers to plucking. That's my story and I'm sticking to it. (Saw that the other day and I liked it). That's also all I'm going to say about this subject.

revolver323 · Post by **revolver323** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 6:52 am

Pick vs. fingers. Flat vs. round. Over in the trombone forum it's slide cream vs. Slide-O-Mix. Face it: anyone who plays in bass clef is a tech geek obsessed with details.

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 7:26 am

quote:

"Here we go, yet again. At least once a week the pick vs. fingers BS starts up. Took till Wednesday this week. Don't you guys ever get tired of this ****?"

answer:

uh .... no ...

besides we needed a break from discussing strings ...

iamthebassman · Post by **iamthebassman** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 7:33 am

"Face it: anyone who plays in bass clef is a tech geek obsessed with details."

True, but when it gets to "you should play your bass this way", and "that way is wrong", and "people will look down on you if you play like that", it just gets silly and stupid. WHO CARES!!!! It's like saying anyone who plays their bass while sitting is wrong, you should always play standing up. Just do what you do and let others do the same. End of silly rant on stupid discussion.

edski · Post by **edski** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 7:42 am

Personally I like to play with my toes while hanging up-side-down...

But some of my band mates have a problem with the appearance, so I appease them and stand upright and play with my fingers.

Honestly, I wonder if some in my band would notice it I played with my feet...although I'm not sure I could keep up with the songs that way, so maybe they would. But I'm sure they'd ask what was wrong...

Singer: "Why are you playing so poorly today, Ed?"

Me: "Well Bobby, I figured I'd try an experiment today and play with my feet. I guess it's not working too well?"

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Wed Jul 13, 2005 8:14 am

"Personally I like to play with my toes while hanging up-side-down..."

I thought I was the only one that did that! I play in a cage though, do you Ed?