Removing the .0047 capacitor? Why ever?

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Sat Jun 22, 2002 5:22 am

I've noticed that many Rick bass owners choose to remove the much-discussed .0047 capacitor from their instruments on the grounds that the treble pickup has less output than the bass one. I don't think this is the wisest move I've ever heard. Unless they don't like the Rickenbacker sound, they should leave that capacitor alone and try to address the low output problem by fitting or have someone fit a stronger magnet to the treble pickup. Yes, this can be done, and with great results! Fitting larger and thus more effective polepieces (as found on the horseshoe pickup design), which can only be done on the latest type of pickup bobbin in which pole pieces fill no structural purpose, is another way of tacking the problem. Let's hear the experts' comments on this one.

gpatt5762 · Post by **gpatt5762** » Sat Jun 22, 2002 5:16 pm

Hmmmm… Low output?

And this is for the Horseshoe Pickup?

Reason I ask: when I installed re-issue vintage pickups on my 4003S, I ended up raising my Toaster as high as it would go to balance the outputs of the two pickups with the capacitor installed inline!

People reporting this problem must be leaving a years-old Hi-Gain in the neck position. I say: Always Change Both! …or get a bigger amplifier!

Garry

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Sun Jun 23, 2002 3:23 am

Hi, Garry. Thanks for reading my post.
Of course I wasn't referring to the horseshoe pickup, only to the button top treble pickup - the horseshoe has power to spare. As for the toaster pickup, I've always felt that it was not all it could be. Meaning? It's pole pieces can't be brought as close to the strings as those on the high-gain pickup and they aren't specially strong. Plus, the coil isn't wrapped as closely to the pole pieces as on the high-gain and it is wound around the middle portion of the pole pieces, which unlike the high-gain, is the least strong portion thereof magnetically. Having said that, the toaster pickup has a great sound, rather fitter for guitar than for bass, in my opinion. Keep those comments coming.

admin · Post by **admin** » Sun Jun 23, 2002 4:33 am

Sergio: With the proper adjustment I consider that the toaster can be well suited for bass as well as guitar. To add some support to this claim, the 4005 produces a very nice sound. It is different from the 4001/4003 sound but nice all the same. You have raised interesting points here. I hope that some 4005 owners will be able to comment on the sound that they get from their bass and compare that to the 4001/4003 sound, with and without horseshoes.

4003seagreen · Post by **4003seagreen** » Sun Jun 23, 2002 8:14 am

I would like to know if anyone has placed a horseshoe on their 4001/4003 and left the high-gain in the neck position? I am contemplating doing this to counter-balance some of the issues I have read about regarding the low-output of the toaster. I'd like to have the punch of the horseshoe, but not at the expense of the output when it is blended together.

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Sun Jun 23, 2002 8:30 am

Hi, Peter. First of all, I wanna thank you for welcoming me to the Forum a couple of weeks back.

Well, I must confess I didn't consider the 4005 bass. To my mind this is probably the Rick bass guitar on which the toaster pickup works best, as it is located at what I would call the 'bassiest position' and is fully adjustable in height. As for the bridge position I'm not so sure the toaster pickup design delivers. I have never played a 4005 bass - this particular Rick bass model is very, very hard to come by in my country (Portugal), but I imagine the treble pickup would pose exactly the same low output problem as SOME 4001/4003 basses. Thanks for reading.

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Sun Jun 23, 2002 8:52 am

Sea Green: I think that leaving the high-gain in the neck position as you suggest is a very good idea, plus you can always fit it with a slightly stronger magnet should you find that it doesn't sound as loud as the horseshoe. Or you can use a toaster and add to it a considerably strong bar magnet long enough to span all six pole pieces, if you are adept enough technically to carry out such a modification. Rick on!

gpatt5762 · Post by **gpatt5762** » Sun Jun 23, 2002 9:14 am

4003seagreen:

What is your bass's current pickup configuration?

gpatt5762 · Post by **gpatt5762** » Sun Jun 23, 2002 9:23 am

For the rest of you:

Sorry to upset anybody, but having switched my 4003S over to all vintage pickups, I cannot see for the life of me why JH ever conjurd up the Hi-Gain pickup in the first place. You lose "The Sound" with those installed. The toaster may ought to be re-named "The Bomb"!

The first thing anyone purchasing their first Rick should do is strip any Hi-Gain pickups off the instrument, throw them in the trash, and order Toasters. Your ears will thank you. The tone from these is quintessential to the Rickenbacker Experience.If more output is needed, get a bigger amplifier. And as regards the cap, that also is integral to the tone of the instrument.

GP

4003seagreen · Post by **4003seagreen** » Sun Jun 23, 2002 9:40 am

Garry, I have the standard high-gains in my 4003. The bass was manufactured in 2000.

rickenbrother · Post by **rickenbrother** » Sun Jun 23, 2002 11:55 am

Instead of removing the C3 capacitor, you can wire a SPDT switch in parallel with that capacitor. Then you can choose to play with or without it.

gpatt5762 · Post by **gpatt5762** » Sun Jun 23, 2002 2:02 pm

4003Cgreen:

How does it feel to be "C-Series" now?

Seriously, I stand by my assertion that the route to Rick Bass Nirvana is via a total change of components.

This is what I did:

Ordered the whole kit (cap, pickups, knobs, and 4001V63 pickguard from Rhoads Music- About $267.-)

Rounded up an electric drill, a Dremel with sanding drum, and a soldering iron.

Took everything off, routed about 3/4" by 3/4" (deep) towards the neck, and I'm NOT a natural mechanic, either.

Switched the "harness" over to the new guard, leaving the paper on the outside face of the guard.

Installed the Horseshoe to the body and routed its wire to the control cavity.

installed the Toaster to the pickguard.
---NOTICE---
THIS is the point at which you can help the Toaster pickup out by replacing, one at a time, the rubber pickup grommets with ultra-thin aluminum washers to allow the pickup more height than usual.

Cut the wire from the selector switch to the treble(Bridge) pickup volume pot and INSTALL the .0047µfd capacitor in its place.
---NOTICE # 2---
If you are the original owner of your 4003, YOU HAVE NO .0047µfd CAP IN THE FIRST PLACE.Take it from one who has made the switch, if you install a Horseshoe pickup, you will want the cap to get correct tone. I cannot over-emphasize this!

Soldered the new pickups and cap in using the scematic and harness diagram I downloaded from RIC's website.

Re-assembled the bass, tuned it up, and grinned for days on end.

Part of the vintage RIC tone is predicated upon correct placement of the neck pickup, also, as it lies where the 24th fret would normally go, a harmonic sweet-spot.

You will be sooooo glad you did it superior when you hear your bass with vintage pickups. Mine sounds like CS thru my church's SS, SOA house system!

Let us know how it goes.

Best of luck,
Garry

rhampshire · Post by **rhampshire** » Mon Jun 24, 2002 10:52 am

I've got the horseshoe bridge and stock neck pickup in my 4001. NO .0047 cap. The horseshoe is MUCH louder than the neck pickup, and adding the cap would surely even them out, but I don't like the sound with the cap - WAY too bright. The bass is plenty bright without it, and I only use the bridge pickup anyway.

bassman · Post by **bassman** » Mon Jun 24, 2002 11:20 am

I would have to agree with most of what Rob is saying. My 72 4001 is equipped the same way, but I left the .0047 cap in and bypassed it with a minor wiring mod. I like the sound of the bass without the cap. But unlike Rob, I always use both pickups. And if someday I change my mind about the sound, I can always remove my bypass wire and have the bass sound like it originally did, bright!
Cheers,
Jon

4003seagreen · Post by **4003seagreen** » Mon Jun 24, 2002 1:11 pm

So has anyone installed a horseshoe in the bridge and left the high gain in the neck? That's the answer I'd like to know.