1,000 days

[bassduke49]

Although I don't remember the EXACT date that I ordered a Blueburst Cheyenne II, it was before RIC went on its annual holiday break in 2005. That's officially the last day I could have ordered a COY for that year, and I delayed my decision to nearly the last moment. I'm figuring the date as 15 December 2005, and today marks the 1,000 day since then that I've waited for the order.

I'm a patient man. If I weren't, I would have cancelled the order long ago. I have had the good fortune to afford to purchase several more Ricks on the used markets (eBay and through Forumites), and sold a few back out, too. I certainly don't have a dire need for any instrument. As my wife says, "You can't play more than one at a time."

I won't get uppish and demand an estimated delivery date. I understand RIC's backlog "problem" (and what a good "problem" to have), but don't quite understand why the less popular models keep getting pushed back (" . . . by the end of the year (2007)" . . . "April" . . . "May" . . . "this fall." I hope RIC doesn't give up on the 4004. I have no way of knowing how many 4004s have been ordered in the last three years, but, if I'm correctly reading the "recently shipped" device on its website, RIC has delivered only a dozen or so 4004s since they started the feature.

But someday, it will come. I just wish I could get some assurance once in a while.

[atomic_punk]

Amen, Paul. Someone far wiser than me said, The Waiting is the hardest part.

I remember waiting for my 4003BBR. it was supposed to be a birthday present that I eventually got a year and a half later! I thought Chris Clayton was going to stop returning my "any news on my Rick" emails because I was hoping for SOME news. You have it way worse than I EVER did.

[beatlefreak]

I know how you feel, Paul. Those of us waiting for a new guitar/bass from RIC feel our faith slipping a little as each week goes by. It doesn't help that we haven't heard any official word on how the backlog situation is progressing for quite some time. All we can do is hang in there....

[vito]

My instrument was ordered in January 2005. At some point, waiting nearly four years for an instrument during which time there have been brief runs of production on the 4004L becomes a customer service issue.

[nukebass]

In the future, only order 4004L MID and 4004CII Trans Blue. Those are popular NAMM models. At least then you know you have a shot at the beginning of each year. I think I ordered mine (Cii BBR) on November 29, 2005, but it was ordered by the dealer, according to his website, 3/18/05. I'm at 1017 since I ordered, but 1273 since the instrument was ordered. I have heard people say they've had 4003s on order since 06, and at least one 4003 BBR is still left, so I don't feel quite as bad as I did in comparison to other people's waits. I had heard that at least 4004Ls would be finished by Thanksgiving, but that was over three months ago and I don't have much confidence in predictions anymore after all the wrong predictions given. It would be silly to cancel the order at this point, especially with the prices as high as they are on new instruments. I understand the backlog, too, I think, but I'm getting jaded on the same reasons for over three years. I know they say they are making progress in reducing the backlog to a more reasonable level, and I have to believe them, but I'll never realize the results of that reduction. The Spring run was highly disappointing and, really, not much more than a tease when (about) 10 basses were made. The fact we must face is that these (apparently) aren't in demand and RIC works them in where they have the least impact on other instruments that are in demand. At least we're better off than the guys with acoustics on order when RIC announced they wouldn't be making them anymore. We at least have some hope of getting our basses in the future.

[basmansam]

I guess if you ordered a JetGlo 4003 you would have had 3 - 4 times now. I understand the max production per day is 25 instruments, x 50 weeks per year(maybe less). My guess: guitar production runs 8x bass production- check recent shipments with the big stores- 79% guitars 11 % basses. Good luck, I hope your wait is almost over.

[beatlefreak]

One thing to remember is that looking at the 'Just Shipped' page on the Corporate webiste gives you only two pieces of information - What was shipped and Who it was shipped to, nothing more. Each entry on that page does not necessarily mean one guitar or bass - It means one order of that model. The dealer showing that an order has been shipped to them might have one in that order, or they might have five (or any other number).

Back when I joined the forum, I believe I read that RIC was doing rather small batch runs of a model (25-30?). I could be wrong on this. Since then, with the addition of new CNC machines and different manufacturing techniques, John Hall has stated that those numbers aren't even close. He wouldn't give numbers, but seemed to hint towards the ballpark of 100-150 guitars or basses in a run. If those numbers are correct (again, I'm not saying that they are), it could help to explain why less popular models, like the 4004 and the 5002V58, are run so seldom. If the order for a dealer who wants a couple of 4004Cii basses comes up, perhaps it gets pushed back until orders for enough of that model come due to make it economical (production-wise) to do a run of them. Again, this is all speculation on my part - Just trying to make some sense of it all. And still, while we wait for the less popular models to be shipped, RIC is trying to keep it's authorized dealers and distributors in a steady supply of it's 'bread and butter' models.

Since the 'Just shipped' page offers no hint of the number of instruments shipped, trying to say that RIC makes 79% guitars against 11% basses is a guess with no basis (basses? ). Look at the number of guitar models against the number of bass models RIC currently offers. As the 4003 is either RIC's most popular model, or their second most popular (depending on whether you're talking to a guitar player or a bass player ), I'm sure the percentage of basses shipped is much higher. Besides, 79% plus 11% equals 90%. Where's the other 10%? Certainly not 5002V58 - They haven't done a run of those in years.

Of course, there are other factors that could delay an authorized dealer's order. John has staed these before. A dealer could be at their credit limit with RIC. They could be late in paying for already shipped orders. They could be on hold due to some other infraction of RIC's dealer agreement. We (the end users) are not RIC's customers. Since they are a manufacturer and wholesaler, their authorized dealers are. So we continue to wait.

[teeder]

Anyone have a guess as to why the 4004's aren't more popular?
In my case, if they had a smaller neck profile, I would be gigging one (or two).

[rickenbrother]

Anyone have a guess as to why the 4004's aren't more popular?
In my case, if they had a smaller neck profile, I would be gigging one (or two).

Not more popular because there is not a popular, influential bassist playing one regularly.

Some players do not like the width of the 4004 neck. It's a bit wider than the 4003. I find the 4004 neck profile (front to back) makes up for the width. The 4004 necks feel quite comfy in my hands.

[teeder]

I've probably suffered from playing only a JB for so many years.

[paul_yan]

I sincerely hope that Paul, Ryan, and Tony (and any other formites who are waiting) get your 4004 Cii or Laredo soon, hopefully before the end of Autumn.

On January 28, 2005, Lindsay Hahn (also a forumite who's been very busy and hasn't posted for a while) and I placed our order of the 4004 Cii BBR through Mike Parks. Lindsay a few hours before me. We actually had said to each other that we would do it together as a way of celebrating a friendship catalysed by this very forum (thanks to Peter again for such a great place where Rickenlovers all over the world bond) We hope our Cii's would be from the same batch and even have consecutive serial numbers. As far as I know, Chris (Pappas) placed his Cii BBR order around the same time as us.

Some months after our ordering, the Cii basses received 3 major changes, one after another:

1-Pickups were moved forward to the 1st generation 4004 positions---closer to the neck.
2-No more fingerboard varnish.
3-Walnut headwings replaced maple.

I wish the first 2 changes didn't occur although I do understand that the "new" pickup positions yield easier repair should there be problems with the truss rods.

In may 2006, Lindsay got his Cii BBR which had been the only one Cii BBR shipped. He was told by Mike that the Cii basses were being produced and shipped singly, so the chance of our having consecutive serial numbers had just vaporised. I was happy for Lindsay and didn't feel too bad that I hadn't got mine at the same time. I was pretty occupied by work and my new life in Beijing anyway and the wait went on without too much pain.

Lindsay loves his beautiful Cii BBR.





2 years passed...After 3 4/12 years of waiting, my Cii BBR was shipped to Mike in late May 2008 . I had Mike ship the bass to Sir Curmudgeon right away for him to mod the inlays and varnish the fingerboard. I won't see my Cii until after Paul does it in March 2009. The wait continues, but it's alright for me.

I don't know if Chris has received his or not...Chris, if you're reading this, I hope your Cii baby has already reached you.

I wish you guys won't have to wait as long as I did.

By the way, I have faith the 4004 line won't be discontinued. It's a modern classic, IMHO.

[incubus2432]

A few years ago when I got my first 4004, my LK which took just over 4 years to receive, I got on a 4004 "kick" and was able to find a new one whenever I looked around a little on the web. In the last two years it has gotten next to impossible to find one that is unspoken for. The 4004 seems to be the unwanted stepchild of the RIC family.....with so very few on the market there is little hope that the series will take off. As far as the neck size "issue" I must be far less sensitive than most since it feels "close enough" to the 4003's I was used to that the switch to being a strict 4004 player was seamless.

I understand the backlog situation at RIC but 3-4 year wait on a "production" model bass is, IMO, heinous. Many one off high end customs are made in far less time. Producing the more popular models likely has some advantage for the company but people who ordered so long ago should receive some consideration and a place in the production schedule. This sort of thing can alienate even loyal admirers.


BTW.....I believe Chris said he cancelled his BBR Cii order because the wait was getting too long. IIRC.

[johnallg]

I would think the 4004 conundrum is just that - a self-fulfilling issue. They are not available, not being made, thus not ordered, and without more orders, do not earn a place in the production scheduling. My take on it, IMHO, Y M M V, F W I W, etc. Add to that what Joey said, no major artist plays one, and we have what we have.

[ajish4]

Paul,

Thanks for posting those 4004Cii pictures, I love seeing them!

You have a great idea, I wasn't aware when I ordered my 4004Cii that the fingerboard wasn't varnished. I guess I just wasn't paying attention.....again.....

That is one mod I may consider.

After she arrives, if I fall in love with her like I'm hoping to, I will probably have that done as well.

I like the fingerboards varnished.

Does anyone know what the reasoning was behind that change? I'm glad the pickups moved up to the neck position, that was the clincher that made me place my order.

I'm going to try to be optimistic here, and hope that they will ship this year. JUST POSSIBLY RIC will do something special for these outstanding orders. PERHAPS we'll get some nicely figured maple?
Who knows...all I can say that when my 4004cii is here, the wait will be the furthest thing from my mind.

[incubus2432]

Does anyone know what the reasoning was behind that change? I'm glad the pickups moved up to the neck position, that was the clincher that made me place my order.

Jeff Scott's ex-Cii had a truss rod problem that required them to be removed and with the p/u's positioned away from the neck the only way to remove the rods (aside from fretboard removal) was to route two channels in the face of the body. With the p/u at the neck the rods can be removed by simply removing the neck p/u. At least that is my understanding for the change. I prefer the current layout, which was also the original.