New price list effective 12/13/2007

[sharkboy]

I don't think this one's your fault for not knowing how your retailer does business, but that really doesn't seem like a fair practice to me. Also, I'd like to hear from Rickenbacker on this, as you do seem to be blaming them.

[rickenrocker]

Rickenbacker has chosen their vendors, even if it were 100% PMBlues, it's the same difference.

[jingle_jangle]

Jeremiah, we try to keep things civil around here. This is perhaps the third time I've seen this sort of language in print on this Forum, and by using it, you've temporarily dragged us down into the same language pool as every other guitar Forum on the web.

My 10-year-old daughter is a regular reader over my shoulder and I'd be pleased if this doesn't happen again.

[rickenrocker]

There's no point in my posting here anyway.

[melibreits]

Jeremiah, I understand your disappointment and your frustration, but I really don't think it's fair to blame RIC if your dealer is raising the price on a guitar you had already ordered.... I don't think that RIC can be held responsible for the end price that your dealer is charging. It seems to me that it would be unethical to raise the price on a guitar that has already been ordered with money down.

[janglerocker]

I remember reading a Post from JH at the last price hike stating that guitars already ordered were not affected by the price increase and if a dealer were to bump the price on an existing order he would consider that usury.

[admin]

Jeremiah: This language and accompanying attitude is unacceptable. Forum members will note numerous edits as required. I apologize to all. I am sorry to have been so long getting to these edits and stepping in here. We can all relax now and continue with our usual cordial discussions.

Paul: Your daughter wil not have to be bothered by Jeremiah's language any longer.

[blueflamerick]

John Hall's comment on the previous price increase can be seen here:

http://www.rickresource.com/phpBB3/view ... e+#p304453

[rickenbrother]

I don't have a problem with supply and demand, or price increases.

I do have a problem with Rickenbacker dangling pretty guitars in front of people for X dollars, putting everyone on backorder for years, and then charging everyone a higher $ amount when they finally ship.

Talking with PM blues today, even though I was quoted a dollar amount, and put down a %20 deposit, I can no longer afford the 660/12 AFG that I've been anticipating for a long time.

This isn't how you do business. If you don't have the ******** guitars, don't ******* pretend to sell them. This price change during an order is immoral.

Your problem is definitely with your dealer, not RIC. Now that I know this, I wouldn't ever bother inquiring about a Rick from PM Blues. The dealers that I buy Ricks from, practice far better business ethics than that!!

[johnhall]

I need to jump in here, if only briefly, before I return to my "no post" policy.

We don't raise the price on guitars that are already on order, in fact we still have many on the books awaiting production that will still be shipped at the 2001 prices.

However, you can argue both ways about the dealers raising prices now. On the one hand, there's an argument that instruments currently in stock (or on order at protected old prices) should be sold at prices reflective of their actual cost. But you can also argue that the cost to replace that item in inventory is the proper cost to base pricing on.

Obviously, as a consumer I would prefer the first option but if I operated a shop I'd tend to favor the second. It's a tough call either way, but it's a call the stores make, not us.

This might be a good time to point out a couple of other things that have been overlooked or misstated, especially on one other forum in particular. This last price increase was, on average, just under 20%, plus or minus a bit due to rounding. Including this most recent price change, the total average increase is about 34% as compared to 2001. I don't hear anyone remembering now all those years that we didn't increase prices. (There were a couple of model-specific exceptions where there were extraordinary cost increases or a need to reposition certain models in the line.)

Another point totally overlooked is the fact that it will probably be at least a year before the first instrument goes out the door at the new prices, so in effect this is really a late 2009 or early 2010 price increase. Similarly, as I said earlier, a large percentage of our current backlog will be shipped at the same prices we charged for these items in 2001.

North American customers probably think they don't care about this but we have a large export business; these clients are currently enjoying a huge windfall due to the weak dollar exchange rate. (None have lowered their dealer prices in response to this.) We're trying to recapture some of that and use it to offset our increased costs for parts, especially imported ones, for example, Gotoh and Schaller keys. That indirectly benefits the domestic consumer.

Speaking of costs, consider these facts:

Solder increased 116% in the last 15 months alone.

Case costs have risen 20% in the last 12 months.

Copper has almost doubled since 2005, affecting brass components as well.

The price of zinc is up about 59% this year although large quantities of Chinese zinc is helping to keep the price down.

I don't have to tell anyone what's happened with oil, which directly affects cost of the coatings and plastic we use.

The good news is that quality Maple has held very solid, although charactered premium Maple has become overly expensive, mainly through the manipulation of specialty wood brokers.

[ajish4]

I guess one could always talk with their feet.

If a dealer "sticks it to you" as the one already named, just don't go back. There still are some dealers who will go that extra mile for their customers.

CME pulled a nasty bit of business with the 75th Anniversary guitars, and while they may have profited from the one time action, they have lost untold amounts of sales because of said actions.

I can't tell you how many times I spotted a bass on Gbase that caught my eye. As soon as I noted who the dealer was, I closed the page. PERIOD.

A GOOD realationship with a dealer is a two way street, sort of like a limited partnership. I deal with just two dealers. Sometimes one more than the other but I try to keep it balanced. Both have been straight up with me in the past and therefore, I continue to order from them and ONLY those two.

I would think a smart business person would want the customer coming back again and again (while making continued sales) than the short term, one time hit.

Just my 2 cents.

[rickenbrother]

I would think a smart business person would want the customer coming back again and again (while making continued sales) than the short term, one time hit.

That's right, a dealer that does right by me gets my repeat business plus customer referrals. Try to do me wrong, you'll never get my money and I'll advise people to stay away from that particular dealer.

[nukebass]

I thought that if you had a deposit on a guitar for a given price, and that guitar is sold to the dealer at the same price as it was when you gave your deposit, you have a legal binding contract for that guitar at the given price. Would there not be the potential for legal action in this case?

[elysrand]

... charactered premium Maple has become overly expensive, mainly through the manipulation of specialty wood brokers.

It makes sense then that the price of the 381v69 had to go up. John, you have always consistently used amazing quilted maple on these, and I am proud to own a recent 381v69. It is the best figured maple I have ever seen in a Rick guitar, ever. Thank you for building incredible guitars like these and selling them to our ilk, even to slobs like me

[freshmattyp]

I guess I'll be tracking down a 650D sooner rather than later. I'm not going to let that one get away like I did the 380L.