Can a 4003 truly sound like a 4001?

[bassduke49]

I think there was probably a lot of variation of tone even among the same vintage of 4001, and again in the 4003. There are too many variables involved to try to duplicate a sound that (to you) was "classic." I think there is more "tone" in the player's technique than there is in any instrument or any signal train. Just think of the variables involved in just the setup of a single instrument: string gauge/type; age of string; condition of string; pickup winding/response; pickup height; string height above pickup; string height above fingerboard; intonation; string tension; condition of the wood as constructed; condition of wood after aging/use; value of pots; ratio of dialed-in volume of each pickup; ratio of dialed-in amount of tone for each pickup; mute level; and we haven't even gotten to the amplifier, speaker, or studio board, not to mention all the variables involved with your personal playback equipment and listening environment. You could chase down one particular tone that you want forever. Or you could have just as good a chance at nailing it right with any particular instrument. Might not even be a Rick, who knows? I'd much rather spend the time learning to play properly, effectively, and happily!

[rickinroma]

Paul is right I believe
To some extent and within certain range of nunaces, I eventually and basically get the same sound from all my 4001-shaped basses...and even when using the 4005.
The sound is in your head and you then try to reproduce it, where hands and equipment are part of the equation.

Having said that.... The raw sound of my 4003 IS different from the V63 or C64 and from my old 70s 4001.

It is like listening to the same record in vinyl or on CD

[bassduke49]

Another analogy on equipment and results:

If I had the same brand of golf clubs and balls as Tiger Woods (even if I were to use Tiger's personal set!), I'm pretty sure I won't swing as powerfully or score as low as Tiger. In my case, I'm pretty sure that NO set of golf clubs or special magical golf balls would improve my game. And NO, I don't mean that I shot 59 at Pebble Beach yesterday.

[Baker69]

When you say vintage what are you talking about . What era. The 60's basses with toaster & horseshoe. The early 70's with toaster & early hi-gain. or the later 70's with (in my opinion) weak hi-gains. All 3 of these sound a bit different especially the weak hi-gains. I believe there is an inherent Ric sound due to body shape & such. So you can get reasonably close to any of the vintage variations with a 4003. If your having problems getting the sound of a certain bass player then you need to research their playing technique.

Hi, no I referred to "classic" Ric tone not Vintage.

In my particular case playing style has nothing to do with it, the 4001 I previously owned was a 1978 model and it is this era of bass I am trying to emulate with my 4003, I didn't play the 4001 any different to my 4003. I think my 4001 may have had the weaker hi-gain pickups you refer to and it had an extremely slinky neck.

My 4003 does indeed have the inherent Ric sound but how to get it to sound "reasonably close" to a 1978 4001? I don't know.

Please see the following video by Pierre Blanchette of a Rush song - brilliant 4003 sound which is very close to a 4001 IMHO!

http://youtu.be/Gb-NY-RQDl4

[Badanovski]

The 1978 4001 has the .oo47 cap & weaker hi-gains. To approximate that sound you'd want to roll back the volumes a bit keeping in mind that will cut some highs. In the video the effects he's using are contributing to that sound not to mention the original bass track he's following. One other thing to consider, some of what we perceive as highs are actually upper mids so you'll have to experiment with EQ to get the clank your after.

[Baker69]

The 1978 4001 has the .oo47 cap & weaker hi-gains. To approximate that sound you'd want to roll back the volumes a bit keeping in mind that will cut some highs. In the video the effects he's using are contributing to that sound not to mention the original bass track he's following. One other thing to consider, some of what we perceive as highs are actually upper mids so you'll have to experiment with EQ to get the clank your after.

Thanks for the advice, I'll give it a try.

I thought in the video he might be running it in stereo and putting some distortion on the treble pickup but I think the lead is plugged into the mono socket?

The video is a bit dark but is that a toaster I see?

[jayfbv]

I suppose a complete pickup, harness and tone/volume control swap would go a long way to getting the 4001 sound, but would be quite a costly exercise!

You won't need the wiring changed and I wouldn't mess with the pots at first...you can bump up the values later if you think it's too dark.

I bought a scatterwound toaster from Sergio. I was confused at first, by how little he was asking. It came without a mounting bezel, so it made sense. If he's still winding pickups, this shouldn't be expensive at all. fwiw, I had the button type at the neck position and wanted mostly to not have the buttons for thumb slapping. The button top is 7.69K...which means almost nothing to me period wise. Mid-70's?